Northern Illinois University shooting

[CrAz3D]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/14/university.shooting/index.html

That's too bad.  If only those students had some sort of device that fires projectiles at a high velocity, maybe they could defend themselves with it. hmm

[rabbit]

Or maybe if the shooters didn't have some sort of device that fired projectiles at high velocities this never would have happened in the first place.

[CrAz3D]

That only works in an ideal world, which is far from what exists.

[MyndFyre]

Or maybe if the shooters didn't have some sort of device that fired projectiles at high velocities this never would have happened in the first place.

Yeah, we should have laws that prevent guns from being used to shoot people.  Because obviously, the law-breakers would obey THOSE.

[Blaze]

Or maybe if the shooters didn't have some sort of device that fired projectiles at high velocities this never would have happened in the first place.

Yeah, we should have laws that prevent guns from being used to shoot people.  Because obviously, the law-breakers would obey THOSE.

Restricting access to weapons would surely lower the amount of shootings, though.

All it takes is one craz3y guy with a concealed weapons permit and someone/something to make him upset for this to happen.  Now if that crazy guy couldn't just go down the street to a store that sells guns, it would certainly be more difficult for him to shoot up a school.

[MyndFyre]

Restricting access to weapons would surely lower the amount of shootings, though.

All it takes is one craz3y guy with a concealed weapons permit and someone/something to make him upset for this to happen.  Now if that crazy guy couldn't just go down the street to a store that sells guns, it would certainly be more difficult for him to shoot up a school.

He can't.  He has to already have the weapon.

[Warrior]

Yea, let's get it off the bat that no law would of changed this outcome in any meaningful way.
It's an unfortunate thing to happen, but people need to understand exactly that. These things happen.

Turning this into a large Gun debate spectacle for the sake of arguing is a disrespect to the affected families.

[Ender]

I agree that the gun debate should not be in this thread.

[BigAznDaddy]

I agree that the gun debate should not be in this thread.

agreed now moment of silence for those that passed away *silence*

k now this is the second fatal school shooting in a year wtf. something needs to be done. and guns although i like trained people to have them do not seem to be the answer on campuses. now instead students should carry tazers now that may have an impact....

[Hitmen]

don't tase me bro!

[CrAz3D]

Or maybe if the shooters didn't have some sort of device that fired projectiles at high velocities this never would have happened in the first place.

Yeah, we should have laws that prevent guns from being used to shoot people.  Because obviously, the law-breakers would obey THOSE.

Restricting access to weapons would surely lower the amount of shootings, though.

All it takes is one craz3y guy with a concealed weapons permit and someone/something to make him upset for this to happen.  Now if that crazy guy couldn't just go down the street to a store that sells guns, it would certainly be more difficult for him to shoot up a school.

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.



Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.



BigAznDaddy, how many school shootings have happened this YEAR though?  Like 5 I think?  A couple of school bus ones, a couple of high school ones, and now this university.  Cops OBVIOUSLY cannot protect us so we should be allowed to protect ourselves.
*also* I did already say my prayers and thoughts for those involved in this tragedy

[Warrior]

Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.

That wouldn't really do much except increase how easy it is to get the gun in the hand of the shooter.
The shooter is probably going to off himself when he's done anyway, what makes you think that you'll have time to react while he's on his rampage?

The answer is to accept that these things can, and will happen. The best thing to do is put in measures to get rapid response in the event of something like this. This includes enforcing tighter lockdown rules, drilling more often, and overall getting the awareness into the minds of the students.

[CrAz3D]

Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.

That wouldn't really do much except increase how easy it is to get the gun in the hand of the shooter.
The shooter is probably going to off himself when he's done anyway, what makes you think that you'll have time to react while he's on his rampage?

Chances that a person can react is WAY better if they HAVE a way to react other than being a sitting duck.

[MyndFyre]

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.

{{fact}}

[iago]

In Canada, guns are strictly controlled, but not illegal. However, it is easy enough for criminals to buy them, of course, because they can easily be smuggled in from the United States. In other words, the illegal (by Canada's laws) sale of guns in the US is directly hurting Canada.

Did you know that the US is one of the top violators of Canadian weapon laws?

So I think that the US should start following Canada's laws.

(Then we'll start following your copyright laws)

(For any humour impaired, I'm joking)

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.^{citation needed}

[rabbit]

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.

Statistics also show that people without guns are far less likely to shoot others.

Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.

...unless...you know...EVERYBODY decided to go on a rampage.  I want you to give me PROOF that the only way to prevent shootings is to let everybody have a gun.

BigAznDaddy, how many school shootings have happened this YEAR though?  Like 5 I think?  A couple of school bus ones, a couple of high school ones, and now this university.  Cops OBVIOUSLY cannot protect us so we should be allowed to protect ourselves.
*also* I did already say my prayers and thoughts for those involved in this tragedy

Yeah, cops can't help us.  Neither can the army, the national guard, the navy, the air force, the FBI, the CIA, the NSA, Area 51, the military police, bologna sandwiches, vigilantes, stones, guns, swords, the Power Rangers, Hitler, Castro, Stalin, God, Xenu, banana hammocks, or pizza.  Obviously the only way to save humanity is to liquidate every living person.

[iago]

Yeah, cops can't help us.  Neither can the army, the national guard, the navy, the air force, the FBI, the CIA, the NSA, Area 51, the military police, bologna sandwiches, vigilantes, stones, guns, swords, the Power Rangers, Hitler, Castro, Stalin, God, Xenu, banana hammocks, or pizza.  Obviously the only way to save humanity is to liquidate every living person.

I love how you rated "Xenu" just below the Power Rangers but above pizza.

[rabbit]

Well, the Power Rangers have a transforming space ship, and Xenu just has a regular one.  Unfortunately, pizza doesn't have a spaceship.

[BigAznDaddy]

BigAznDaddy, how many school shootings have happened this YEAR though?  Like 5 I think?  A couple of school bus ones, a couple of high school ones, and now this university.  Cops OBVIOUSLY cannot protect us so we should be allowed to protect ourselves.
*also* I did already say my prayers and thoughts for those involved in this tragedy

yeah i know i was talking about university shootings, but there also was that mall shooting and that one shooting that almost happened at a church until a security guard shot him. and yes i like right to carry a weapon but seriously i dont trust every day people to be carrying them.  i mean the other day this guy in my class was drunk and it was like damn we are here to learn something *hypothetically* not to dick around. anyways i think teachers, professors, some staff should carry weapons if anyone on campus carries them.

[iago]

Well, the Power Rangers have a transforming space ship, and Xenu just has a regular one.  Unfortunately, pizza doesn't have a spaceship.

Correction: they have FIVE transforming ships! More if you count the later seasons (I don't)

[rabbit]

I'm talking about the spaceship though, not the zords.  And if you count the zords, they have the 5 normal ones, then the Godzilla thing (green zord) and the giant white one, which gives them 7.  But the issue of their spaceworthyness is never directly addressed.

[CrAz3D]

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.^{citation needed}

http://www.ncpa.org/press/nrsb052600.html

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.

Statistics also show that people without guns are far less likely to shoot others.

True but irrelevant as criminals will always have guns until the day that no guns exist on this planet which is so improbable it's practically impossible.

Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.

...unless...you know...EVERYBODY decided to go on a rampage.  I want you to give me PROOF that the only way to prevent shootings is to let everybody have a gun.

No one can PROVE anything, you can only take the statistics and see that "an armed society is a polite society."  Look at the link I posted about the Texas law.

BigAznDaddy, how many school shootings have happened this YEAR though?  Like 5 I think?  A couple of school bus ones, a couple of high school ones, and now this university.  Cops OBVIOUSLY cannot protect us so we should be allowed to protect ourselves.
*also* I did already say my prayers and thoughts for those involved in this tragedy

yeah i know i was talking about university shootings, but there also was that mall shooting and that one shooting that almost happened at a church until a security guard shot him. and yes i like right to carry a weapon but seriously i dont trust every day people to be carrying them.  i mean the other day this guy in my class was drunk and it was like damn we are here to learn something *hypothetically* not to dick around. anyways i think teachers, professors, some staff should carry weapons if anyone on campus carries them.

What makes their lives more important than mine that they can protect themselves and I cannot?  Personally, I'm much more reasonable than many professors on campus.  They live in the world of academia, that is FAR from the real world.

[Sidoh]

They live in the world of academia, that is FAR from the real world.

BS.  They're closer to the "real world" than politicians ever are.

Seriously, just because they tend to focus on things that are hypothetical or theoretical (which is clearly not always true) does not mean they're necessarily detached from the "real world."  That's a stupid term anyway.

[rabbit]

Statistics show that people with concealed carry permits are far less likely to be involved in a violent crime than a person without.

Statistics also show that people without guns are far less likely to shoot others.

True but irrelevant as criminals will always have guns until the day that no guns exist on this planet which is so improbable it's practically impossible.

s/criminals/you/; s/guns/bad ideas/;

Warrior, the only laws that would change this is allowing students to carry on campus.  Even if ALL manufacturing of guns was prohibited, someone would do it anyway.  Allowing guns everywhere is the only other law that might change this situation.

...unless...you know...EVERYBODY decided to go on a rampage.  I want you to give me PROOF that the only way to prevent shootings is to let everybody have a gun.

No one can PROVE anything, you can only take the statistics and see that "an armed society is a polite society."  Look at the link I posted about the Texas law.

If you can't PROVE it's the only way, then stop blabbing about how it is.  And Texans are definitely NOT the most polite people.  Look at Sweden or Switzerland or the Netherlands.  They all have heavy restrictions on weapons, and they also happen to be some of the nicest people on the planet.

BigAznDaddy, how many school shootings have happened this YEAR though?  Like 5 I think?  A couple of school bus ones, a couple of high school ones, and now this university.  Cops OBVIOUSLY cannot protect us so we should be allowed to protect ourselves.
*also* I did already say my prayers and thoughts for those involved in this tragedy

yeah i know i was talking about university shootings, but there also was that mall shooting and that one shooting that almost happened at a church until a security guard shot him. and yes i like right to carry a weapon but seriously i dont trust every day people to be carrying them.  i mean the other day this guy in my class was drunk and it was like damn we are here to learn something *hypothetically* not to dick around. anyways i think teachers, professors, some staff should carry weapons if anyone on campus carries them.

What makes their lives more important than mine that they can protect themselves and I cannot?  Personally, I'm much more reasonable than many professors on campus.  They live in the world of academia, that is FAR from the real world.

They have degrees which say they are allowed to teach people things.  You are just some guy who keeps spewing nonsense and annoying people.

[CrAz3D]

rabbit, in response to your post, part by part:

1)

2) It's the only efficient way to do it aside from completely unreasonable and expensive measures that could never be justified (it'd be complete and INTENSE martial law)

[Sidoh]

s/criminals/you/; s/guns/bad ideas/;

Don't forget /g!

[Joe]

I agree that the gun debate should not be in this thread.

agreed now moment of silence for those that passed away *silence*

k now this is the second fatal school shooting in a year wtf. something needs to be done. and guns although i like trained people to have them do not seem to be the answer on campuses. now instead students should carry tazers now that may have an impact....

Take the school aspect out of it. Schools are just another place it happens. I heard on the news only a few days ago that a guy got shot on the street in Madison, and they said they didn't think the guy had a motive. Even if he did, he shouldn't have been able to have a gun. How many fatal shootings have there been in the US over the past year?

[Joe]

Well, the Power Rangers have a transforming space ship, and Xenu just has a regular one.  Unfortunately, pizza doesn't have a spaceship.

What kind of transportation do Hitler, Castro and Stalin use then?

[iago]

s/criminals/you/; s/guns/bad ideas/;

Don't forget /g!

No wonder I got confused!

[rabbit]

Well, the Power Rangers have a transforming space ship, and Xenu just has a regular one.  Unfortunately, pizza doesn't have a spaceship.

What kind of transportation do Hitler, Castro and Stalin use then?

Hitler had the Wermacht, which pretty much forced the rest of the world to develop technology double-time.  Castro make cigars, and Stalin was a fucking badass.

[iago]

Well, the Power Rangers have a transforming space ship, and Xenu just has a regular one.  Unfortunately, pizza doesn't have a spaceship.

What kind of transportation do Hitler, Castro and Stalin use then?

Hitler had the Wermacht, which pretty much forced the rest of the world to develop technology double-time.  Castro make cigars, and Stalin was a fucking badass.

No space ships? Are you certain?

[rabbit]

His brains were splattered before he got to the spaceship point in history.

[Explicit]

Pizza's are in saucer form... that's spaceship enough for me!

[Hitmen]

Hitler had a jetpack, duh.

[Falcon]

New reports on Yahoo claims the 27 year old bought 2 guns legally a week before the shooting. So he got pissed at something and decided to just walk into a store, buy some guns, and start shooting people. It is way too easy to get your hands on a gun here in the US.

[CrAz3D]

s/criminals/you/; s/guns/bad ideas/;

Don't forget /g!

I'm still completely confused

New reports on Yahoo claims the 27 year old bought 2 guns legally a week before the shooting. So he got pissed at something and decided to just walk into a store, buy some guns, and start shooting people. It is way too easy to get your hands on a gun here in the US.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/15/university.shooting/index.html
He was off of his meds, maybe that's why he flipped.
Also, shotguns aren't handguns ... he also had a shotgun.  There is no way in hell that you could prevent the ownership of shotguns and rifles.

[Sidoh]

s/criminals/you/; s/guns/bad ideas/;

Don't forget /g!

I'm still completely confused

It's sed syntax.  s is search, the next two tokens are search for and replace with respectively, g is globally.