rough week

[BigAznDaddy]

K so as some of you guys know i got a concussion the other week(last last thursday). and it sucks.
to add to this misery we just lost a BIG lacrosse game(thursday).

Friday:
but to lighten things up i went to disneyland (yesterday/ friday) from 6 in the morning till 12:00 at night and had the best time of my life.

SATURDAY:
today i got home from disneyland at 2:00 am and had work at 7:00am but i accidentally slept in to 8:00am so i had to speed to get to work which is about 40 minutes away. and sure enough i was pulled over by a California Highway patrol officer. now this is my first ticket anyone know or have any suggestions for me? my court date is in june right after my graduation. the officer seemed very nice too and we went into a little conversation about how to be a officer and the benefits.

ARG and today i find out i was not accepted to UCSD WTF!!!

but now i am in spring break so that may lighten up my spirits. and i think i am going to take a huge nap

[Krazed]

How fast?

[BigAznDaddy]

84 i didn't even realize i was going that fast. you know sometimes when you get in a zone and all you do is look ahead of you and there is no cars around. well just as i realized i was going that fast boom lights appeared.

OH i have a question they spelt my middle name wrong. so is there any way to turn it against them?

[CrAz3D]

June?  WTF!?

Plead not guilt, then @ pre trial conference you are going to want to try to talk with the officer and get a deferred sentence (like probation, just cant get a speeding ticket for like 3-6 months)

[leet_muffin]

See you at SDSU. =). Join the SDSU Racing engineering club, it looks pretty neat.

[trust]

June?  WTF!?

Plead not guilt, then @ pre trial conference you are going to want to try to talk with the officer and get a deferred sentence (like probation, just cant get a speeding ticket for like 3-6 months)

I disagree. Plead nolo contendere, most likely you'll get your ticket reduced to faulty equipment since it's your first violation. You might have driving school, but probably not. Faulty equipment is a non-moving violation and isn't reported to DMV or your insurance. You'll end up paying around $140 after the fine/court cost. At least that's what I paid, your county's fines are probably different but it should be around that price range. I freaked out after I got mine, but it really isn't that big of a deal especially since it's your first one. I was in and out of the court room in 15 minutes.

Here's what happened:
My name was called to the bench, the judge read the speed etc. and asked the officer if that was correct. He said yes, the judge asked me how I pled I said no contest. He said he's reducing it to faulty equipment and asked if the cop disagreed, he said no. i left and paid, the end.

[iago]

What's the difference between "guilty" and "no contest"? I've always wondered that, but never actually looked it up/asked.

[rabbit]

In America, we have 2.5 pleas:
1. I think you have enough evidence to prove it (Guilty)
2. I think you don't have enough evidence to prove it (Not-Guilty)
2.5. I have no idea how much evidence you have either way, so I figure I won't risk incriminating myself further (no contest)

IIRC no contest is only allowed for the lowest level offenses.

[BigAznDaddy]

I disagree. Plead nolo contendere, most likely you'll get your ticket reduced to faulty equipment since it's your first violation. You might have driving school, but probably not. Faulty equipment is a non-moving violation and isn't reported to DMV or your insurance. You'll end up paying around $140 after the fine/court cost. At least that's what I paid, your county's fines are probably different but it should be around that price range. I freaked out after I got mine, but it really isn't that big of a deal especially since it's your first one. I was in and out of the court room in 15 minutes.

Here's what happened:
My name was called to the bench, the judge read the speed etc. and asked the officer if that was correct. He said yes, the judge asked me how I pled I said no contest. He said he's reducing it to faulty equipment and asked if the cop disagreed, he said no. i left and paid, the end.

yeah but i was on a freeway and there was no radar gun iirc

[CrAz3D]

June?  WTF!?

Plead not guilt, then @ pre trial conference you are going to want to try to talk with the officer and get a deferred sentence (like probation, just cant get a speeding ticket for like 3-6 months)

I disagree. Plead nolo contendere, most likely you'll get your ticket reduced to faulty equipment since it's your first violation. You might have driving school, but probably not. Faulty equipment is a non-moving violation and isn't reported to DMV or your insurance. You'll end up paying around $140 after the fine/court cost. At least that's what I paid, your county's fines are probably different but it should be around that price range. I freaked out after I got mine, but it really isn't that big of a deal especially since it's your first one. I was in and out of the court room in 15 minutes.

Here's what happened:
My name was called to the bench, the judge read the speed etc. and asked the officer if that was correct. He said yes, the judge asked me how I pled I said no contest. He said he's reducing it to faulty equipment and asked if the cop disagreed, he said no. i left and paid, the end.

No, always plead not guilty (unless you were a fuck-head to the officer).  For my MIP (minor in possession) it was a MANDATORY MINIMUM of 30 hrs of community service and a fine.  If you plead Not Guilty you get scheduled for a pre trial conference.  There you talk with the officer and you agree on some 'punishment' and plead No Contest on those terms.

If you plead straight out No Contest then it's up to the judge.

With Not Guilty then pre trial conference you at least get an extra attempt to reduce stuff even more.  The cop be an ass and say "I'm going to push all the way through" but then you can still plead No Contest and "throw yourself at the mercy of the Court (judge)."




rabbit, no.  Not at all.

[trust]

I disagree. Plead nolo contendere, most likely you'll get your ticket reduced to faulty equipment since it's your first violation. You might have driving school, but probably not. Faulty equipment is a non-moving violation and isn't reported to DMV or your insurance. You'll end up paying around $140 after the fine/court cost. At least that's what I paid, your county's fines are probably different but it should be around that price range. I freaked out after I got mine, but it really isn't that big of a deal especially since it's your first one. I was in and out of the court room in 15 minutes.

Here's what happened:
My name was called to the bench, the judge read the speed etc. and asked the officer if that was correct. He said yes, the judge asked me how I pled I said no contest. He said he's reducing it to faulty equipment and asked if the cop disagreed, he said no. i left and paid, the end.

yeah but i was on a freeway and there was no radar gun iirc

Cops have radar in their cars, they don't have to be sitting on the side of the road holding a gun. Likewise radar goes both directions so if he was driving towards you (what happened to me) or behind you, he can still clock you. Depending on your state laws he may also be able to pull you over based off of an eye balled speed. Faulty equipment means that something is wrong with your cars equipment. It's not a moving violation so you don't get an insurance increase, and that's usually what it's reduced to here.

@CrAz3D: there's no point in going through additional hearings than you have to. I knew I would be fined, so what would have been my reason to plead not guilty? If I had been reckless (20 over, I was 14) then I might have because of the new fines in Virginia. It's punishable by up to a year in prison, 6 months suspended license, and a $2500 fine.

[warz]

pay it like you're supposed to, and next time don't get caught. don't be a girl and look for some free ride out of it.

[Krazed]

Fuck that, take my advice in tell us now.

[trust]

pay it like you're supposed to, and next time don't get caught. don't be a girl and look for some free ride out of it.

that's the worst advice here. although his fine might not be very much, his insurance will go up. I don't know if he pays his insurance or not, but either way it's an unneeded added expense.

[CrAz3D]

I disagree. Plead nolo contendere, most likely you'll get your ticket reduced to faulty equipment since it's your first violation. You might have driving school, but probably not. Faulty equipment is a non-moving violation and isn't reported to DMV or your insurance. You'll end up paying around $140 after the fine/court cost. At least that's what I paid, your county's fines are probably different but it should be around that price range. I freaked out after I got mine, but it really isn't that big of a deal especially since it's your first one. I was in and out of the court room in 15 minutes.

Here's what happened:
My name was called to the bench, the judge read the speed etc. and asked the officer if that was correct. He said yes, the judge asked me how I pled I said no contest. He said he's reducing it to faulty equipment and asked if the cop disagreed, he said no. i left and paid, the end.

yeah but i was on a freeway and there was no radar gun iirc

Cops have radar in their cars, they don't have to be sitting on the side of the road holding a gun. Likewise radar goes both directions so if he was driving towards you (what happened to me) or behind you, he can still clock you. Depending on your state laws he may also be able to pull you over based off of an eye balled speed. Faulty equipment means that something is wrong with your cars equipment. It's not a moving violation so you don't get an insurance increase, and that's usually what it's reduced to here.

@CrAz3D: there's no point in going through additional hearings than you have to. I knew I would be fined, so what would have been my reason to plead not guilty? If I had been reckless (20 over, I was 14) then I might have because of the new fines in Virginia. It's punishable by up to a year in prison, 6 months suspended license, and a $2500 fine.

That extra step can save you ALL KINDS of money, though.  If you deal with the cop you might get a 3 month deferral and pay no fines.

[iago]

pay it like you're supposed to, and next time don't get caught. don't be a girl and look for some free ride out of it.

that's the worst advice here. although his fine might not be very much, his insurance will go up. I don't know if he pays his insurance or not, but either way it's an unneeded added expense.

But at the same time, you're sacrificing your honesty and integrity, especially if you knew you were doing something wrong. You were caught, pay the fine, gg.

That's my stand on it.

[CrAz3D]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

[BigAznDaddy]

i was thinking about pleading no contest then go to traffic school to get the ticket off my insurance and my records. it should cost about $200 in total?

[iago]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

[CrAz3D]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

It's not saying you didn't ... you get to the pre trial conference that way.  It IS working in the system otherwise you would be punished for abusing it.

[trust]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

pleading not guilty, and especially no contest, is not lying or saying you didn't do something wrong. It's exercising your right to not incriminate yourself and placing the burden of proof on the prosecution. He's a teenager who got his first ticket, they'll be lenient and speeding tickets hike up insurance rates by a lot. Even if he pleads guilty it'll probably still be reduced unless the judge is a dick, but there's no reason to do it.

[d&q]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

[iago]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

I try to go the opposite way, "take responsibility for your actions and mistakes"

But that's just me.

[CrAz3D]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

[iago]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

Saying you aren't guilty when you know you're guilty is a lie, period, whether or not it's a valid avenue. It'd be against my ethics to do that unless I believed there was a good reason.

This morning, I actually read an interesting quote about this in the code of ethics I have to agree to:

There is an interesting relationship between law and ethics. Most often, laws are based on ethics and are put in place to ensure that ohers act in an ethical way. However, laws do not apply to everything -- that's where ethics should kick in. Some things may not be illegal, but that does not necessarily mean they are ethical.

That sort of applies to the situation.

[CrAz3D]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

[Krazed]

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

[iago]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

To me, my integrity is more important than a little bit of money.

The justice system is stupid. If they're going to waste everybody's time and money with meaningless trials, why bother having them?

[CrAz3D]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

No.  You're just saying you want a trial, that's your right after all.

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

To me, my integrity is more important than a little bit of money.

Actually, people think you're stupid if you DON'T plead not guilty for a speeding ticket or whatever.
I wasn't 100% on the whole process and I plead no contest to my "racing on the highways" tickets (spinning tires) and the judge spoke as if I were stupid for pleading not contest (in hindsight, I was).

[iago]

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

No.  You're just saying you want a trial, that's your right after all.

It's your right, but it's still a lie.

Actually, people think you're stupid if you DON'T plead not guilty for a speeding ticket or whatever.
I wasn't 100% on the whole process and I plead no contest to my "racing on the highways" tickets (spinning tires) and the judge spoke as if I were stupid for pleading not contest (in hindsight, I was).

So the justice system encourages dishonesty. You're just using the, "it's ok because everybody else does it" excuse.

[trust]

It's not a lie, it shifts the burden of proof. Do you not have insurance increases in Canada or something? His insurance is already sky high because of his age/gender, plus he's AZN and everyone knows they suck at driving. (except the ones in fast and the furious tokyo drift they were badass) anyway it'd be financially irresponsible to just send in the fine and not go to court.

regardless of what you think about it, most judges are lenient to first offenders.

[Krazed]

Yes, because people don't make mistakes and should definitely face the worst possible sentence for minor obstructions? It's 100% impossible for a judge to let you off because you plead guilty. If it's written in the book, you recieve this sentence for this act, that's what you're given. However -- If you plead not guilty, speak with the judge/officer, they see you have no other infractions.. Why shouldn't you be allowed a second chance and a smaller sentence? Integrity? Honesty? Welcome to 2008.

[iago]

It's not a lie, it shifts the burden of proof. Do you not have insurance increases in Canada or something? His insurance is already sky high because of his age/gender, plus he's AZN and everyone knows they suck at driving. (except the ones in fast and the furious tokyo drift they were badass) anyway it'd be financially irresponsible to just send in the fine and not go to court.

regardless of what you think about it, most judges are lenient to first offenders.

Yes, we have insurance increases.

Like I said before, being encouraged to do it doesn't make it right.

Yes, because people don't make mistakes and should definitely face the worst possible sentence for minor obstructions? It's 100% impossible for a judge to let you off because you plead guilty. If it's written in the book, you recieve this sentence for this act, that's what you're given. However -- If you plead not guilty, speak with the judge/officer, they see you have no other infractions.. Why shouldn't you be allowed a second chance and a smaller sentence? Integrity? Honesty? Welcome to 2008.

If the law is that bad, then they should change is so that the punishment fits the crime.

It's depressing that people think that integrity and honesty are dead, though. That's why I think it's even more important to be honest -- to set a good example. Nobody else is doing it.

[trust]

It's not that the punishments are too harsh (I think here it's $5 for each mile over up until 20 miles over, because 20mi is reckless driving and that's a lot worse.) You also pay court fees, which is another $70 or so. That alone isn't that harsh, because figure if you're 14 over that's $140 fine. It's a lot of money to just give away, but it's not excessive. The reasoning for judges reducing the charge is to avoid the insurance spike. I know my parents pay, just for me, the price it costs both of them to be insured. I'm an 18 year old male, so a speeding ticket is something that could fuck up the cost of insurance even more.

[iago]

That sounds reasonable. I guess the solution is..... don't speed?

[trust]

That sounds reasonable. I guess the solution is..... don't speed?

True, but sometimes it's done completely on accident (as in his case) and you just happen to get pulled over before you realize it.

[Quik]

i was thinking about pleading no contest then go to traffic school to get the ticket off my insurance and my records. it should cost about $200 in total?

That's probably the best option. In California, if you complete the traffic school, it stays off your record and insurance doesn't find out about it. It's the guaranteed way to save you money.. the other ways are just hoping the cop doesn't show, or can't prove anything, or the judge is nice. If you try to play the system and fail, it's doubtful you'll have the option to go back and say "ok I fucked up, now can I have traffic school and save myself at least some money?" -- doesn't really work like that.

[warz]

you might as well just cry when a cop pulls you over

[rabbit]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

Saying you aren't guilty when you know you're guilty is a lie, period, whether or not it's a valid avenue. It'd be against my ethics to do that unless I believed there was a good reason.

A plea of "not-guilty", in the legal stance, means "I doubt you have enough evidence to prove I did anything", not "I didn't do it".


This morning, I actually read an interesting quote about this in the code of ethics I have to agree to:

There is an interesting relationship between law and ethics. Most often, laws are based on ethics and are put in place to ensure that ohers act in an ethical way. However, laws do not apply to everything -- that's where ethics should kick in. Some things may not be illegal, but that does not necessarily mean they are ethical.

That sort of applies to the situation.

That's a pretty good quote

[CrAz3D]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

Saying you aren't guilty when you know you're guilty is a lie, period, whether or not it's a valid avenue. It'd be against my ethics to do that unless I believed there was a good reason.

A plea of "not-guilty", in the legal stance, means "I doubt you have enough evidence to prove I did anything", not "I didn't do it".

Saying "not guilty" doesn't even go that far.