rough week

[iago]

pay it like you're supposed to, and next time don't get caught. don't be a girl and look for some free ride out of it.

that's the worst advice here. although his fine might not be very much, his insurance will go up. I don't know if he pays his insurance or not, but either way it's an unneeded added expense.

But at the same time, you're sacrificing your honesty and integrity, especially if you knew you were doing something wrong. You were caught, pay the fine, gg.

That's my stand on it.

[CrAz3D]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

[BigAznDaddy]

i was thinking about pleading no contest then go to traffic school to get the ticket off my insurance and my records. it should cost about $200 in total?

[iago]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

[CrAz3D]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

It's not saying you didn't ... you get to the pre trial conference that way.  It IS working in the system otherwise you would be punished for abusing it.

[trust]

Working within the system is not sacrificing honesty or integrity, it's being smart. 

No, when you know you did something wrong, and you say you didn't, you're lying. Period.

You aren't "working within the system", you're "abusing the system". There's a difference.

pleading not guilty, and especially no contest, is not lying or saying you didn't do something wrong. It's exercising your right to not incriminate yourself and placing the burden of proof on the prosecution. He's a teenager who got his first ticket, they'll be lenient and speeding tickets hike up insurance rates by a lot. Even if he pleads guilty it'll probably still be reduced unless the judge is a dick, but there's no reason to do it.

[d&q]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

[iago]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

I try to go the opposite way, "take responsibility for your actions and mistakes"

But that's just me.

[CrAz3D]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

[iago]

You're talking like abusing the system is a bad thing  . Always look out for #1(Me).

Abusing the system is using incorrectly ... working in the system is different.

The system HAS that avenue for people to take, if it was an abuse it wouldn't exist.

Saying you aren't guilty when you know you're guilty is a lie, period, whether or not it's a valid avenue. It'd be against my ethics to do that unless I believed there was a good reason.

This morning, I actually read an interesting quote about this in the code of ethics I have to agree to:

There is an interesting relationship between law and ethics. Most often, laws are based on ethics and are put in place to ensure that ohers act in an ethical way. However, laws do not apply to everything -- that's where ethics should kick in. Some things may not be illegal, but that does not necessarily mean they are ethical.

That sort of applies to the situation.

[CrAz3D]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

[Krazed]

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

[iago]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

To me, my integrity is more important than a little bit of money.

The justice system is stupid. If they're going to waste everybody's time and money with meaningless trials, why bother having them?

[CrAz3D]

pleading not guilty is not the same as telling someone you're not guilty.

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

No.  You're just saying you want a trial, that's your right after all.

.. it's a speeding ticket, iago. It'd just be stupid to throw up the white flag, put your hands behind your back, and scream "GIVE ME THE MAXIMUM SENTENCE!" Come on now... There's a million and one loopholes for a reason, America's justice system is about giving chances. Plead not guilty, ALWAYS. No contest is stupid, just plead not guilty. Two chances is better then one. Pay the small fines they'll give you, ask for something with no points.

To me, my integrity is more important than a little bit of money.

Actually, people think you're stupid if you DON'T plead not guilty for a speeding ticket or whatever.
I wasn't 100% on the whole process and I plead no contest to my "racing on the highways" tickets (spinning tires) and the judge spoke as if I were stupid for pleading not contest (in hindsight, I was).

[iago]

Errr.. am I the only one who that sounds weird to? Isn't that what you're doing when you plead not guilty?

No.  You're just saying you want a trial, that's your right after all.

It's your right, but it's still a lie.

Actually, people think you're stupid if you DON'T plead not guilty for a speeding ticket or whatever.
I wasn't 100% on the whole process and I plead no contest to my "racing on the highways" tickets (spinning tires) and the judge spoke as if I were stupid for pleading not contest (in hindsight, I was).

So the justice system encourages dishonesty. You're just using the, "it's ok because everybody else does it" excuse.