US credit rating downgraded

[CrAz3D]

...and I was more concerned with that than being surrounded by strippers.  I'm too "old" to go out at midnight when the good looking strippers hit the floor.  Whatever.

anyway, WHAT THE FUCK @ credit rating.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/05/news/economy/downgrade_rumors/index.htm?iref=BN1
further WTF-ness:

A source familiar with the matter said S&P initially miscalculated the growth trajectory of the nation's debt, and then went ahead with its downgrade anyway.

[while1]

Out of the three major credit rating agencies, the S&P one is the only one that has downgraded our rating.  Moody's and some other agency hasn't downgraded our rating, but I'm sure this will cause a negative reaction come Monday when the markets open. 

[CrAz3D]

Agreed.  Also, like the quote I ... err ... quoted ... S&P apparently miscalculated shit and made the downgrade anyway.

I bet D.C. is a shitty place to be right now.

[deadly7]

Not that this will change anything, but the shitholes at DC (both R and D alike) can't continue entitlement and pork spending indefinitely without a raise in government income to match the borrowing.

[nslay]

With Tea Party nutters in power, we'll continue to have black-and-white policies.

These idiots actually think the Federal Government is the same as a person, a business or a State Government. Indeed, most State Governments balance their budget, but the Federal Government can bail them out (they don't mention that last part). Who bails the Federal Government out?

This isn't Republicans and Democrats being stupid, this whole debacle was caused by the Tea Party and their simpleton views. The Democrats and non-Tea Party Republicans were ready to compromise.

[deadly7]

Who bails the Federal Government out?

They do, by printing more money and causing excess inflation.

[Armin]

This isn't Republicans and Democrats being stupid, this whole debacle was caused by the Tea Party and their simpleton views.

speaking of simpleton views...

[nslay]

This isn't Republicans and Democrats being stupid, this whole debacle was caused by the Tea Party and their simpleton views.

speaking of simpleton views...

Can you name any Tea Party member who was prepared to compromise? No taxes, no closing loop-holes, or no deal.

[MyndFyre]

Can you name any Tea Party member who was prepared to compromise? No taxes, no closing loop-holes, or no deal.

Can you explain what the benefit of the compromise was?  We ended up... oh yeah, getting a ton of new debt and, as we saw, the S&P downgraded our credit.

No, compromise didn't help the US.  Not spending more money was what was going to help the US.

[nslay]

Can you name any Tea Party member who was prepared to compromise? No taxes, no closing loop-holes, or no deal.

Can you explain what the benefit of the compromise was?  We ended up... oh yeah, getting a ton of new debt and, as we saw, the S&P downgraded our credit.

No, compromise didn't help the US.  Not spending more money was what was going to help the US.

The only compromise made was the amount of spending cut (which apparently pissed S&P off). There was no revenue on the table even though there probably ought to have been.

The solution isn't as simple as immediate spending cuts. Immediate drastic spending cuts on some of these programs can have very negative effects on the economy (because it has negative effects on consumers). Nobody wins in that situation. The same goes for taxes. Imposing taxes in the wrong places will most certainly hurt the economy. It's not a simple problem ... that's why they forwarded it to a super committee. It'll be interesting to see what they do.

The debt problem has to be solved in the long term and in a gentle way.

I don't like that the debt ceiling was raised anymore than you, but the alternatives are worse. Indeed, we didn't have to default on August 2nd. We could pay our interest and then leave a substantial portion of the Federal Government unpaid. No matter how you divide that remainder up, something important (a lot) isn't accounted for.

[deadly7]

Not spending more money was what was going to help the US.

Politicians in any party don't care, save a handful. Beyond entitlement spending, which is going to become a behemoth and piss off healthcare providers the world over, the size of the government is more to blame. Entitlement is just the low-hanging fruit to which all politicians can point at, since actual reform (eg: removing useless things like the TSA, food subsidies, etc.) requires real work.

[CrAz3D]

IIRC, the debt bill cut 2.something trillion over ten years, however, the projected debt is still around 26t.  So we cut it 10%.  That's not drastic.  Further, we never would've seen those cuts had the "simpletons" compromised.  We would've had fewer cuts, and probably very little revenue increase.

We need extreme cuts and modest revenue increase. 

Also, the Senate bill apparently went further than Boehner's originally proposed bill. 
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/jul/27/democrats-debt-bill-beats-gop-version-spending-cut/

Like armin suggested, your simpleton remark is rather applicable to your whole post(s).

[dark_drake]

We need extreme cuts and modest revenue increase. 

It was a joke hearing they were in serious negotiations, but revenue increases were already off the table. So, when's the next time the elephant and donkey are going to create a crisis and still not go far enough to fix it? October next year?

[nslay]

IIRC, the debt bill cut 2.something trillion over ten years, however, the projected debt is still around 26t.  So we cut it 10%.  That's not drastic.  Further, we never would've seen those cuts had the "simpletons" compromised.  We would've had fewer cuts, and probably very little revenue increase.

We need extreme cuts and modest revenue increase. 

Also, the Senate bill apparently went further than Boehner's originally proposed bill. 
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/jul/27/democrats-debt-bill-beats-gop-version-spending-cut/

Like armin suggested, your simpleton remark is rather applicable to your whole post(s).

I agree, but modest modest revenue increase? The Tea Party wouldn't have it. And yes they are simpletons because they don't compromise in the name of extreme ideaology. They also compare the Federal Government's spending to personal and business finance ... simplistic point of view that ... these people are complete idiots.

I mean even some of the senior Republicans think that the Tea Party is cuckoo. Did you see McCain complaining to his own party?

The senior officials were ready to solve this problem with compromises and give the world economy a better impression of our government as a coherent and cooperative ruling body. The recent spiral downward is partly due to this drama we saw (which was undisputably caused by the Tea Party).

[Armin]

Like armin suggested, your simpleton remark is rather applicable to your whole post(s).

I was mostly suggesting that "this whole debacle" was not "caused by the Tea Party and their simpleton views". The significant failure is that we find ourselves in a seemingly inescapable, ever-growing debt, which was caused by decades of ineptitude and poor policy of both Republicans and Democrats. Scapegoating the Tea Party is all too easy and narrow sighted.