WoW = Spyware

[Furious]

Monitoring processes that have an impact on WoW, sure, but monitoring the computer to try and see if they have anything that could possibly have an impact is wrong, what if you had some random program running, and they banned your key because they thought it may be some type of hack. 

[Sidoh]

I don't think they'd be that assumptious.

[Furious]

Just as an example, and I don't know much about the Warden, but say you were on WoW, and someone told you to look at a site, it had a picture of a maphack or something, the name of the picture:

Internet Explorer - wowmh.jpg

Do you think they would get you because of that? Is it an automated program, or do people watch over the warden and verify everything it detects?

[Quik]

Just as an example, and I don't know much about the Warden, but say you were on WoW, and someone told you to look at a site, it had a picture of a maphack or something, the name of the picture:

Internet Explorer - wowmh.jpg

Do you think they would get you because of that? Is it an automated program, or do people watch over the warden and verify everything it detects?

The article was a little exaggerated, it won't ban you because of the name of a window title, IIRC. It checks the code to see what it does, and hashes some of it and checks it against a database of 'malicious hack' hashings.

The point is that it's going through everything open on your computer to find hacks, and not caring about what it's going through.

[Blaze]

I have found that the majority of the people that feel bad about this, have this in common:

• Do not play WoW
• Were ending there subscription anyway

[Screenor]

TSE, seriously, do you even know how hacks work? You're not understanding.

(A) You play the game everyday, if you don't like what it's doing, don't play it, it's their program, their software, their way of catching programs that may give the user an advantage over others. If you don't like how it works, don't play the game and expect them to change it for your "privacy".

(B) It scans the programs running for certain strings, it doesn't pay attention to the name of the window, because that would give them NO information on what it actually does, it pays no attention to what you're running, it simply scans them (as I said before) for certain malicious strings that interact with WoW.

(C) This is being blown way out of proportion, some of you guys obviously don't understand what it's doing exactly, and are just looking at it as "bad".

Don't like it? Don't get the game, should have done your research. Get some other less-fun MMO and play that for a month and get bored.

[TheSickEmpire]

TSE, seriously, do you even know how hacks work? You're not understanding.

I sent you an in-game mail pertaining to this, seeing as you never mentioned it again I'll assume this arguement is over.

(A) You play the game everyday, if you don't like what it's doing, don't play it, it's their program, their software, their way of catching programs that may give the user an advantage over others. If you don't like how it works, don't play the game and expect them to change it for your "privacy".

I guess you didin't read what I said about how software EULA's are completely out of control.

(B) It scans the programs running for certain strings, it doesn't pay attention to the name of the window, because that would give them NO information on what it actually does, it pays no attention to what you're running, it simply scans them (as I said before) for certain malicious strings that interact with WoW.

No, warden scans open process names and acts accordingly.

(C) This is being blown way out of proportion, some of you guys obviously don't understand what it's doing exactly, and are just looking at it as "bad".

I can see how I blew it out of proportion, but, that really doesn't change much.

Don't like it? Don't get the game, should have done your research. Get some other less-fun MMO and play that for a month and get bored.

Again, you didin't read my EULA bit. By the time you've bought the game and opened it, you're then given the EULA. This is done purposefully. It's not as if you can return an open game.

Now, you may argue that "well, you should have looked at their website". All I can say to that, is some people don't have access to  an internet connection (by the way, I'm talking about all software, not just WoW).

[Armin]

Either WoW will be loaded with hackers and be extremely unfair, or have them scan your processes for malicious scripts. Since they chose the latter, you have the choice not to even play the game. I'm actually glad they did this, it levels the game out, and it's not like they're actually spying on us like said.

[Quik]

Either WoW will be loaded with hackers and be extremely unfair, or have them scan your processes for malicious scripts. Since they chose the latter, you have the choice not to even play the game. I'm actually glad they did this, it levels the game out, and it's not like they're actually spying on us like said.

I think the point is that they have the capability (and some may say the means) to do so.

[Armin]

In that case, any program you install has the capability of doing something malicious without you knowing, they just have to implement it. WoW has not implemented anything that would allow them to spy on you.

[Blaze]

EULA's may, or may not be out of control.  Its up to the Software Company to decide what there software does because it is THERE software, not yours.  If you don't like the way they run the game, as stated before, Don't play it.

[TheSickEmpire]

EULA's may, or may not be out of control.  Its up to the Software Company to decide what there software does because it is THERE software, not yours.

Quite so. However, there are no laws governing EULA's. Even so, courts treat them as binding contracts. They could write just about anything in their EULA's and it would be a legally binding contract. This, and this reason alone, is the reason why EULA's can't be taken seriously.

[Armin]

EULA's may, or may not be out of control.  Its up to the Software Company to decide what there software does because it is THERE software, not yours.

Quite so. However, there are no laws governing EULA's. Even so, courts treat them as binding contracts. They could write just about anything in their EULA's and it would be a legally binding contract. This, and this reason alone, is the reason why EULA's can't be taken seriously.

Are you sure about that? I remember hearing somewhere that you have to patent your EULA or something like that before it's a legal contract.

[Screenor]

I sent you an in-game mail pertaining to this, seeing as you never mentioned it again I'll assume this arguement is over.

I don't read most in-game mail because the font Blizzard chose for it is extremely ugly.

I guess you didin't read what I said about how software EULA's are completely out of control.

Then you should just not buy any online games then, considering there's so "out of control", since that's what you're going to have to expect in any game these days.

No, warden scans open process names and acts accordingly.

Show me where Blizzard says this is exactly what Warden does, you're basing your beleifs on third-party reports, therefore not 100% reliable. Unless you somehow managed to hex the client (which I know you didn't because I know you can't), don't start throwing these random remarks out as an excuse.

I can see how I blew it out of proportion, but, that really doesn't change much.

The sky's falling.

Again, you didin't read my EULA bit. By the time you've bought the game and opened it, you're then given the EULA. This is done purposefully. It's not as if you can return an open game.

Wal-Mart.

Now, you may argue that "well, you should have looked at their website". All I can say to that, is some people don't have access to  an internet connection (by the way, I'm talking about all software, not just WoW).

Then I'd suggest you don't buy online games.

EULA's may, or may not be out of control. Its up to the Software Company to decide what there software does because it is THERE software, not yours.

Quite so. However, there are no laws governing EULA's. Even so, courts treat them as binding contracts. They could write just about anything in their EULA's and it would be a legally binding contract. This, and this reason alone, is the reason why EULA's can't be taken seriously.

Wrong, EULA's can't say they have all rights to your mother and/or house, and so on and so forth, MM's last post is exactly what happens.

You obviously aren't knowelgable on how EULA's work, let alone the Warden.

[Joe]

The fact is, if enough people did get pissed off, Blizzard wouldn't have much choice but to remove Warden from WoW. I'll sit tight and hopefully just that will happen.

No, the fact isn't that.  The only way they'd change is if enough people got pissed off and quit WoW citing the reason that Warden is invading their privacy before they took Warden from WoW.  It won't happen.

They may not lose many current customers, but people who read this will quite possibly not buy WoW because of Warden, and only Warden.

They have the compacity to invade my privacy. Even though I doubt they would, I still dislike that they're doing so. I mean, really, do you like the fact that you're being monitored?

I seriously doubt that, in their list of windows that are bad, there is a hashing even remotely similar to the result of the hash of "WoW is gay"...

It was an example as to the compacity for their program to do something similar.

If newby is correct, they can't monitor you. Your tasks are hashed and compared to a hashed list (which nobody ever said was remote, but probably is). Now, say you're running processXXX.exe, and its an identified hack. You hash it to say, AABBCED, and send it. AABBCED is in the list. Your hacking. You're also running processXXY.exe. You hash it to AABBCEE and send it. Its not in the list, and they have no clue what it is.