Torture in prisons?

[Screenor]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

I don't know.

[Sidoh]

You seem to know enough to condemn them.  But now you admit you don't know much about it?  I tend to make a practice to not condemn people for beliefs that I don't know/understand. 

Why would suicide bombers yell "FOR ALLAH" before they blew themselves up if this wasn't true?  It certainly is true I'm not very informed about the practices of their religion, but I am aware of this particular aspect.

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason? You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes. Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why? Why would they hate somebody who's innocent? And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

I don't know.

Good point.

[Screenor]

You seem to know enough to condemn them.  But now you admit you don't know much about it?  I tend to make a practice to not condemn people for beliefs that I don't know/understand. 

Why would suicide bombers yell "FOR ALLAH" before they blew themselves up if this wasn't true?  It certainly is true I'm not very informed about the practices of their religion, but I am aware of this particular aspect.

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason? You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes. Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why? Why would they hate somebody who's innocent? And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

I don't know.

Good point.

Some say a picture says a thousand words, well, that says three: Innocence, Mourning, Revenge.

[iago]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

Because the radical Islamics just do. They're stuck in the dark ages and theink they're still fighting in a jihad (and have called it that). America is an overall Christian nation, and anyone that supports it (including by living here, notice muslims died on 9/11) is their enemy and deserves to die.

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC?  I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

[Screenor]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

Because the radical Islamics just do. They're stuck in the dark ages and theink they're still fighting in a jihad (and have called it that). America is an overall Christian nation, and anyone that supports it (including by living here, notice muslims died on 9/11) is their enemy and deserves to die.

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC?  I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

Who even says a reason is needed to kill a person? There's not always logic behind something, take Tupac Shukur's death, he was killed in a drive by, was there any known reasoning behind it? No. Same with terrorism, it's called that for a reason.

[iago]

Who even says a reason is needed to kill a person? There's not always logic behind something, take Tupac Shukur's death, he was killed in a drive by, was there any known reasoning behind it? No. Same with terrorism, it's called that for a reason.

Of course there's a reason!  Do you really think people would sacrifice their own lives without a reason?  I'm pretty sure their religion wouldn't have told them to just for the hell of it. 

Terrorism is called that because it's done to provoke terror.  It's obviously not possible to fight the US in a clean war, because the US is too powerful.  So they fight the war in the only way they can, by trying to destroy the moral; you can't forget, they're people too, with hopes, desires, families, etc..  And, with the help of every newspaper blowing every attack out of proportion, it's working.  The entire point of terrorism is the scare people, and the only way to stop that effect is to not tell anybody that it happened.  Suddenly, you've made what they do completely pointless, so why would they continue doing it?  That's just my belief, though. 

Put yourself in their place, for a moment.  Say there's a huge evil empire that basically governs or tries to govern the world.  Think along the lines of the book 1984, or Farenheight 451, Final Fantasy 3, or even the Cardassian war.  I'm not saying America is evil, but people (and yes, we can't forget that they ARE people) do perceive you that way (and this torture thing isn't helping..).  How would you, a small group, fight a large evil empire?  Would you declare war, and attempt to sail in? Of course not, that's suicide.  The only way is to attack it from the inside.  Small, strategic attacks, against soft targets, exactly what was done by the Bajorans.  Yes, it's dirty fighting, but how else do you suggest fighting a war with an empire like the USA? 

[Sidoh]

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC? I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

I'm sure you're aware that the US is built on religious (Christian) morals.

[Hitmen]

Torturing people for information is retarded for reasons other than the fact that it's just a horrible thing to do.

From Reservoir Dogs:

If you fucking beat this prick long enough, he'll tell you he started the goddamn Chicago fire, now that don't necessarily make it fucking so!

It's just a stupid way to try to get information out of someone.

[Sidoh]

Torturing people for information is retarded for reasons other than the fact that it's just a horrible thing to do.

From Reservoir Dogs:

If you fucking beat this prick long enough, he'll tell you he started the goddamn Chicago fire, now that don't necessarily make it fucking so!

It's just a stupid way to try to get information out of someone.

Completely agreed.

[trust]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

Because the radical Islamics just do. They're stuck in the dark ages and theink they're still fighting in a jihad (and have called it that). America is an overall Christian nation, and anyone that supports it (including by living here, notice muslims died on 9/11) is their enemy and deserves to die.

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC?  I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

Maybe because, you know, it totally disrupted our way of life....

Look at the riots in France, those stupid muslims got pissed because two hoodlum teens were electrocuted when they broke in some place - that was the straw that broke the camels back. They were all mad because France is openly racist towards them, and they were "oppressed." Now the fools (mostly uneducated lower-class muslims from North Africa living in France's version of the projects) are running around beating people to death, setting youth centers and hospitals etc (in their own neighborhoods) on fire, etc. Now, iago, why should they attack their own neighborhood if they're mat at the French government? It proves a point and it does affect the government indirectly.

[iago]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

Because the radical Islamics just do. They're stuck in the dark ages and theink they're still fighting in a jihad (and have called it that). America is an overall Christian nation, and anyone that supports it (including by living here, notice muslims died on 9/11) is their enemy and deserves to die.

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC?  I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

Maybe because, you know, it totally disrupted our way of life....

When you say "our way of life", do you mean you as a Christian, or you as an American?  If it only/mostly disrupted Christians' ways of life, then ok, I'm wrong.  But if it disrupted everybody in America, not just Christians, then there's something wrong with that. 

It seems like a lot of people also think that living in, for example, Iraq is sufficient cause to be an enemy.  I've heard people (Americans, only) say that they should nuke Iraq.  How, exactly, is that different from them hating people for living here?

[Sidoh]

When you say "our way of life", do you mean you as a Christian, or you as an American?  If it only/mostly disrupted Christians' ways of life, then ok, I'm wrong.  But if it disrupted everybody in America, not just Christians, then there's something wrong with that. 

It seems like a lot of people also think that living in, for example, Iraq is sufficient cause to be an enemy.  I've heard people (Americans, only) say that they should nuke Iraq.  How, exactly, is that different from them hating people for living here?

No, it affected Americans.  The vast majority of Amercains do not share their same views, which they believe "unholy."  That's why they did what they did.

[Screenor]

Do you really think they (or their God) would hate you so much for no reason?  You can't be THAT blind to believe that's the only reason.

Yes.  Im pretty sure they believe their leader/creator hates every other religion (and the people who practice them).

Assuming he does, why?  Why would they hate somebody who's innocent?  And what about athiests, do they hate them too?

Because the radical Islamics just do. They're stuck in the dark ages and theink they're still fighting in a jihad (and have called it that). America is an overall Christian nation, and anyone that supports it (including by living here, notice muslims died on 9/11) is their enemy and deserves to die.

If they're against religion, why attack the WTC?  I thought that the WTC was attacked because it was an economic target, not religious..

Maybe because, you know, it totally disrupted our way of life....

When you say "our way of life", do you mean you as a Christian, or you as an American?  If it only/mostly disrupted Christians' ways of life, then ok, I'm wrong.  But if it disrupted everybody in America, not just Christians, then there's something wrong with that. 

It seems like a lot of people also think that living in, for example, Iraq is sufficient cause to be an enemy.  I've heard people (Americans, only) say that they should nuke Iraq.  How, exactly, is that different from them hating people for living here?

You know what the problem arguing with someone from Canada is? The fact that no one goes to war with Canada, because they have nothing of any need to anyone else, they don't help outside country's (for the most part), immigrants don't try and get in their country, and if Canada was attacked for some reason, the only one helping you would be America. IMHO Canadians have no right to put down any other country, because they don't have one mother fuckin thing to back them up if they're insulted.

The fact that no one ever does anything between Canada isn't a good reason for you to be bashing on America just because you're not powerful enough to do anything. As Sidoh said, this country was started based on Relgion, who the FUCK are you trying to tell that we're not a religious country? The fact that we don't kill people for not worshiping one god? Sorry, but that's not human, and that's not fair. The country was founded for freedom of religion, this much later we're still the land of the free, and still have freedom of religion, people still are trying to get into our country, and what does that tell you? How in any god damned way does that tell you that we're "evil"? Lets go back to the days of the WW's, we liberated the french from the Nazi's, did we have to? No. Were people trying to get into Germany at all costs at that time? No. Were people trying to escape to places such as America? Yes. We're at war now even and people are still trying to get into our country. Why? We're obviously not "evil", that's for sure.

Now iago, you are so for the fact that people murder for a reason, tell me, does that reason have to be just? Or simply does it need to be a reason of any kind? i.e. Hitler killed millions because they were Jewish, does that make it just? Because he didn't like Jews? Even though he was born under a Jewish mother? Sadam killed millions of his own, let alone attacked us multiple times, so tell me, do you know why? You obviously don't so stop trying to justify it. If Canada was attacked that severely they'd fight back too, but they don't, why? Because they would get owned, your country is way too weak to even speak of war, it's stupid and pointless to talk about war for you guys because you've simply never had it, and never will due to your millitary looking like this:



You shouldn't bash your country's only line of defense.

[iago]

You know what the problem arguing with someone from Canada is? The fact that no one goes to war with Canada, because they have nothing of any need to anyone else

I thought it was pretty clearly stated here that they were fighting because of religion.  And  you said that they were fighting for no reason.  So why does their religion hate America but not hate Canada, as you're implying?

they don't help outside country's (for the most part),

That's crap.  We have peacekeeping troops all over the world, and we've fought in all the major wars.

I looked it up.  We have peacekeepers currently in the following countries/regions:
[NOTE: these numbers are from 2003.  The current ones wouldn't be much different, however]
- Middle East (since 1948)
- Korea (since 1953)
- Cyprus (since 1964)
- Syria (Golan) (since 1974)
- Lebanon (since 1978)
- Sinia (since 1986)
- Balkins (over 4 missions since 1991)
- Iraq/Kuwait (since 1991)
- Western Sahara (since 1991)
- Cambodia (since 1992)
- Georgie (since 1993)
- Liberia (since 1993)
- The Netherlands (since 1993)
- Guatemala (since 1994)
- Haiti (since 1997)
Source: http://www.dfait-maeci.gc.ca/peacekeeping/missions-en.asp

immigrants don't try and get in their country

We have lots of immigration.  From the year 1995 - 2004, the total number of annual immigrants was:
212,869 226,073 216,038 174,200 189,966 227,465 250,638 229,040 221,355 235,824
That's no small number.  In those years, these are the total numbers of refugees per annum:
27,193 28,097 23,865 22,506 24,357 30,078 27,914 25,109 25,981 32,685
Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/pub/facts2004.pdf [warning >1mb]
<edit> And don't forget, Canada's total population is only about 31million (as of 2001 source), so that's a significant percentage. 

if Canada was attacked for some reason, the only one helping you would be America.

Again, that's crap.  Britain would help us for sure.  And don't forget, if the US was attacked, Canada would probably be the only one helping, too. 

IMHO Canadians have no right to put down any other country, because they don't have one mother fuckin thing to back them up if they're insulted.

Well, it's hard to be insulted by ignorant American children who know nothing about Canada.  But hopefully the facts I've posted here will open your eyes a little, although I doubt it. 

Your first paragraph is so grossly misinformed that I'm not going to waste my time reading the rest of your post.  Please don't waste my time until you actually learn a little about my country, ok?

[Screenor]

You know what the problem arguing with someone from Canada is? The fact that no one goes to war with Canada, because they have nothing of any need to anyone else

I thought it was pretty clearly stated here that they were fighting because of religion.  And  you said that they were fighting for no reason.  So why does their religion hate America but not hate Canada, as you're implying?

So YOU'RE implying that there can't be more then one probabillity? And by the way: We declared war with them, not the other way around. We did so due to the attacks such as 9/11.

they don't help outside country's (for the most part),

That's crap.  We have peacekeeping troops all over the world, and we've fought in all the major wars.

I looked it up.  We have peacekeepers currently in the following countries/regions:
[NOTE: these numbers are from 2003.  The current ones wouldn't be much different, however]
- Middle East (since 1948)
- Korea (since 1953)
- Cyprus (since 1964)
- Syria (Golan) (since 1974)
- Lebanon (since 1978)
- Sinia (since 1986)
- Balkins (over 4 missions since 1991)
- Iraq/Kuwait (since 1991)
- Western Sahara (since 1991)
- Cambodia (since 1992)
- Georgie (since 1993)
- Liberia (since 1993)
- The Netherlands (since 1993)
- Guatemala (since 1994)
- Haiti (since 1997)
Source: http://www.dfait-maeci.gc.ca/peacekeeping/missions-en.asp

Peacekeeping doesn't support economy, you're not helping other country's, you're keeping yourselves from getting owned.

immigrants don't try and get in their country

We have lots of immigration.  From the year 1995 - 2004, the total number of annual immigrants was:
212,869 226,073 216,038 174,200 189,966 227,465 250,638 229,040 221,355 235,824
That's no small number.  In those years, these are the total numbers of refugees per annum:
27,193 28,097 23,865 22,506 24,357 30,078 27,914 25,109 25,981 32,685
Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/pub/facts2004.pdf [warning >1mb]
<edit> And don't forget, Canada's total population is only about 31million (as of 2001 source), so that's a significant percentage. 

Those numbers are pretty much bull, Canada immigration as compared to America is nothing.

if Canada was attacked for some reason, the only one helping you would be America.

Again, that's crap.  Britain would help us for sure.  And don't forget, if the US was attacked, Canada would probably be the only one helping, too. 

No shit? If we were taken out you'd be the obvious secondary target.

IMHO Canadians have no right to put down any other country, because they don't have one mother fuckin thing to back them up if they're insulted.

Well, it's hard to be insulted by ignorant American children who know nothing about Canada.  But hopefully the facts I've posted here will open your eyes a little, although I doubt it. 

Your first paragraph is so grossly misinformed that I'm not going to waste my time reading the rest of your post.  Please don't waste my time until you actually learn a little about my country, ok?

You're forgetting the fact that this (being your clan), IS a majority of American children, correct? The only reason we don't know much about Canada is the fact that it's not important enough to waste time learning about how it was formed by the French and Britans that lost to us in the Revolutionary war. Please don't waste our time untill you learn a little more about our country, ok?

I don't directly dislike you, I do however (along with most people here) dislike the fact that you insult America so easily like it's nothing, it's pitiful and at large, disgraceful.

This is just like the Microsoft discussion we had a while back. Every country has their flaws, America is just the largest, and therefore receives the most bullshit from lesser, more jealous country's.