Microsoft Patents FAT

[Warrior]

After initially rejecting Microsoft's File Allocation Table (FAT) patents, the USPTO has ruled them valid. From the article: 'Microsoft has won a debate where they were the only party allowed to speak, in that the patent re-examination process bars the public from rebutting arguments made by Microsoft, said unimpressed Public Patent Foundation President Dan Ravicher.

Source: slashdot

[iago]

What's the implication of this?

[Warrior]

They are appearantly charging per unit to use it.

[rabbit]

But we can just use ext/2/3/ReiserFS or NTFS?  Or damn near one of a billion others?

[Newby]

Hahaha. Who the fuck would use FAT?

[rabbit]

Microsoft...wait...didn't they switch to NTFS?

[Armin]

It's not that they switched, it's just that FAT doesn't work on partitions larger than I think 10GB, so they created NTFS which not only handles larger partitions, but also is more secure or something of the sort. You can still use FAT on any Windows install if you wish.

[Warrior]

It's not that they switched, it's just that FAT doesn't work on partitions larger than I think 10GB, so they created NTFS which not only handles larger partitions, but also is more secure or something of the sort. You can still use FAT on any Windows install if you wish.

Of course it does, however it does come with some draw backs and uses nasty work arounds for long file names. It fragmentates easily and has no recovery from an unexpected shutdown. It has no built in security features it's way out of it's time.

But regardless it's a HIGHLY portable DOCUMENTED and SIMPLE filesystem which many OSes seem to use. Microsoft has already been collecting fees from companies which use FAT on it's hardware.

Also appearantly this only applies for thier "VFAT" which adds the long filename extension (Christ that's an ugly hack)

[Eric]

It's not that they switched, it's just that FAT doesn't work on partitions larger than I think 10GB, so they created NTFS which not only handles larger partitions, but also is more secure or something of the sort. You can still use FAT on any Windows install if you wish.

NTFS was developed for Windows operating systems that were based off the NT kernel which Windows 95/98 did not use and as a side note: FAT32 supports up to 32 GB.

[Warrior]

Correct, based off HPFS (iirc) and it's a phenomenal Filesystem. The only downside is the lack of documentation for it which Microsoft refuses to give out. From the open documentation I've seen however, it's extremely complicated when it comes to it's security measures.

In light of this new patenting a few of us are developing a new Filesystem which will be even simpler than FAT, allow long filenames out of the box, and be extremely easy for anyone to implement into thier OS.

[Eric]

Correct, based off HPFS (iirc) and it's a phenomenal Filesystem. The only downside is the lack of documentation for it which Microsoft refuses to give out. From the open documentation I've seen however, it's extremely complicated when it comes to it's security measures.

It's encryption, compression and user permissions are definately some of it's impressive aspects.

[Armin]

It's not that they switched, it's just that FAT doesn't work on partitions larger than I think 10GB, so they created NTFS which not only handles larger partitions, but also is more secure or something of the sort. You can still use FAT on any Windows install if you wish.

and as a side note: FAT32 supports up to 32 GB.

Mehh, I knew 10GB didn't sound right.

[iago]

NTFS was developed for Windows operating systems that were based off the NT kernel which Windows 95/98 did not use

It's encryption, compression and user permissions are definately some of it's impressive aspects.

Duh.  I should give you the Mr. Obvious award

[Warrior]

But we can just use ext/2/3/ReiserFS or NTFS?  Or damn near one of a billion others?

We CAN but the problem is, except for ext2/3 there are no Windows drivers availible (Talking for other OSes sure it's possible but for small medias it isn't practical, for example who IN THE FUCK would format a FLOPPY with NTFS or ext2?) Even WITH the windows ext2/3 drivers availible, there is no way to naitively install them OR change your current partition to that format.

[MyndFyre]

We CAN but the problem is, except for ext2/3 there are no Windows drivers availible (Talking for other OSes sure it's possible but for small medias it isn't practical, for example who IN THE FUCK would format a FLOPPY with NTFS or ext2?) Even WITH the windows ext2/3 drivers availible, there is no way to naitively install them OR change your current partition to that format.

I've formatted a ZIP100 floppy to NTFS before because I wanted the data security.  However, because of the way security is structured on NTFS, if the data had been encrypted, it would have been impossible to retrieve following a format.

As for ext2/3 - you're right, but I don't think that there's a way to install Linux on NTFS either.    Realistically, you *could* modify Windows to boot from ext2/3 as long as you could modify the portion of the executive and kernel that is started when Windows is first being booted.