My website design > *

[GameSnake]

That doesn't look so old school-ish to me, I thought most old school web designs were bascially HTML and a banner?

[Mesiah]

I meant old school as the nav buttons attatched to a bar on the left, content box, and nav on the top. Most new websites have all sorts of crazy stuff to the left and right and everywhere in between.

[Quik]

That doesn't look so old school-ish to me, I thought most old school web designs were bascially HTML and a banner?

No, that's pretty oldskool. Usually the process of learning goes from Photoshop/Image Ready -> coding parts by yourself, with heavy use of images -> fully self-coded HTML/CSS.

It's the general learning pattern. You'll find that many of the better sites you go to will have minimal images, just because it saves on bandwith and loading time. Websites shouldn't be fancy and flashy, just there to convey information.

[deadly7]

That doesn't look so old school-ish to me, I thought most old school web designs were bascially HTML and a banner?

No, that's pretty oldskool. Usually the process of learning goes from Photoshop/Image Ready -> coding parts by yourself, with heavy use of images -> fully self-coded HTML/CSS.

It's the general learning pattern. You'll find that many of the better sites you go to will have minimal images, just because it saves on bandwith and loading time. Websites shouldn't be fancy and flashy, just there to convey information.

I skipped steps one and two.

[Quik]

That doesn't look so old school-ish to me, I thought most old school web designs were bascially HTML and a banner?

No, that's pretty oldskool. Usually the process of learning goes from Photoshop/Image Ready -> coding parts by yourself, with heavy use of images -> fully self-coded HTML/CSS.

It's the general learning pattern. You'll find that many of the better sites you go to will have minimal images, just because it saves on bandwith and loading time. Websites shouldn't be fancy and flashy, just there to convey information.

I skipped steps one and two.

That just means you haven't had enough practice with your current medium. If anything, it's bad.

[deadly7]

That doesn't look so old school-ish to me, I thought most old school web designs were bascially HTML and a banner?

No, that's pretty oldskool. Usually the process of learning goes from Photoshop/Image Ready -> coding parts by yourself, with heavy use of images -> fully self-coded HTML/CSS.

It's the general learning pattern. You'll find that many of the better sites you go to will have minimal images, just because it saves on bandwith and loading time. Websites shouldn't be fancy and flashy, just there to convey information.

I skipped steps one and two.

That just means you haven't had enough practice with your current medium. If anything, it's bad.

I've been making websites for around 6 years, give or take a couple months.  How have I NOT had enough practice?

[Sidoh]

I've been making websites for around 6 years, give or take a couple months.  How have I NOT had enough practice?

Deadly, I seriously mean no offense by the following statement.

You may have been around websites for six years, but "making websites" shouldn't include using the WYSIWYG editors on GeoCities; anyone can do that!  If that were the case, I've been in webdev for 8 years!

[deadly7]

I've been making websites for around 6 years, give or take a couple months.  How have I NOT had enough practice?

Deadly, I seriously mean no offense by the following statement.

You may have been around websites for six years, but "making websites" shouldn't include using the WYSIWYG editors on GeoCities; anyone can do that!  If that were the case, I've been in webdev for 8 years!

Uh, I never EVER used WYSIWYG.  I always straight up coded my websites.  I've hated WYSIWYG.  I just used Geocities because I knew nobody on the internet and had no host.

[Sidoh]

Uh, I never EVER used WYSIWYG.  I always straight up coded my websites.  I've hated WYSIWYG.  I just used Geocities because I knew nobody on the internet and had no host.

No offense, then... you've progressed rather slowly.

[deadly7]

Uh, I never EVER used WYSIWYG.  I always straight up coded my websites.  I've hated WYSIWYG.  I just used Geocities because I knew nobody on the internet and had no host.

No offense, then... you've progressed rather slowly.

Nah, I didn't know what CSS or anything was -- Geocities back then was a bitch and never allowed any of that.  One day I was browsing HTMLgoodies.com (where I learned a lot of what I know) and saw Cascading Style Sheets. Being the curious 9 year old I was I clicked onto it.  I took CSS slow and steady because CSS is a bit complex at first, and I'd never done anything close to it.  I took the better part of a year learning CSS and how it works in relation to browsers and stuff (I think Firefox was starting out back then, like early alpha.. not sure).  After that I spent about three years just honing it on and off and making random websites on Geocities and then I finally got a real web host and got more interested in computers/programming/websites.  Then I met Mythix (I thought you were an asshat at first. !) and he told me to learn XHTML so I did.. Now I'm sort of learning PHP, but not really.  I don't feel like it, really.  Sure it's useful as fuck, but I do web design on a small-scale basis (i.e. friends pay me a bit to make them something, or family, or family's friends, etc) and none of those really have what I would consider a use for PHP on a wide-scale.

Yeah, I probably did progress slowly, but I remember EVERYTHING I've learned (every rule, 99% of tags, 99% of the CSS code I've ever learned).

[Sidoh]

Nah, I didn't know what CSS or anything was -- Geocities back then was a bitch and never allowed any of that.  One day I was browsing HTMLgoodies.com (where I learned a lot of what I know) and saw Cascading Style Sheets. Being the curious 9 year old I was I clicked onto it.  I took CSS slow and steady because CSS is a bit complex at first, and I'd never done anything close to it.  I took the better part of a year learning CSS and how it works in relation to browsers and stuff (I think Firefox was starting out back then, like early alpha.. not sure).  After that I spent about three years just honing it on and off and making random websites on Geocities and then I finally got a real web host and got more interested in computers/programming/websites.  Then I met Mythix (I thought you were an asshat at first. !) and he told me to learn XHTML so I did.. Now I'm sort of learning PHP, but not really.  I don't feel like it, really.  Sure it's useful as fuck, but I do web design on a small-scale basis (i.e. friends pay me a bit to make them something, or family, or family's friends, etc) and none of those really have what I would consider a use for PHP on a wide-scale.

Yeah, I probably did progress slowly, but I remember EVERYTHING I've learned (every rule, 99% of tags, 99% of the CSS code I've ever learned).

It literally takes two weeks or less to learn HTML and CSS.  They're not even programming languages... they're markup languages.  I'm not trying to bash on you or anything, it's just the way I see it.  The transition from XHTML to HTML is nearly painless.  You close all your tags in the correct order, make sure that tags that don't have close tags are appended with a slash anyway and that's pretty much all you need to know.

I remember every HTML tag and CSS property I've learned too, but that doesn't mean there's more that I've accidentally forgotten about or never discovered.  If you look deeply enough, I bet you'll find a lot of CSS properties you've never even heard of.

[deadly7]

Nah, I didn't know what CSS or anything was -- Geocities back then was a bitch and never allowed any of that.  One day I was browsing HTMLgoodies.com (where I learned a lot of what I know) and saw Cascading Style Sheets. Being the curious 9 year old I was I clicked onto it.  I took CSS slow and steady because CSS is a bit complex at first, and I'd never done anything close to it.  I took the better part of a year learning CSS and how it works in relation to browsers and stuff (I think Firefox was starting out back then, like early alpha.. not sure).  After that I spent about three years just honing it on and off and making random websites on Geocities and then I finally got a real web host and got more interested in computers/programming/websites.  Then I met Mythix (I thought you were an asshat at first. !) and he told me to learn XHTML so I did.. Now I'm sort of learning PHP, but not really.  I don't feel like it, really.  Sure it's useful as fuck, but I do web design on a small-scale basis (i.e. friends pay me a bit to make them something, or family, or family's friends, etc) and none of those really have what I would consider a use for PHP on a wide-scale.

Yeah, I probably did progress slowly, but I remember EVERYTHING I've learned (every rule, 99% of tags, 99% of the CSS code I've ever learned).

It literally takes two weeks or less to learn HTML and CSS.  They're not even programming languages... they're markup languages.  I'm not trying to bash on you or anything, it's just the way I see it.  The transition from XHTML to HTML is nearly painless.  You close all your tags in the correct order, make sure that tags that don't have close tags are appended with a slash anyway and that's pretty much all you need to know.

I remember every HTML tag and CSS property I've learned too, but that doesn't mean there's more that I've accidentally forgotten about or never discovered.  If you look deeply enough, I bet you'll find a lot of CSS properties you've never even heard of.

I was eight years old and I really hated computers a lot.  If I tried to learn HTML and CSS now I'm sure I could learn it easily in a month (combined).  You forget, you've been around computers a longer time then I have.  When I started learning I didn't care for computers, I didn't like computers.  So naturally I wouldn't want to spend a LOT of time learning something that I thought I would never ever use in real life.  You're entitled to your own opinion on how easy/hard it is to learn, but all I can say is as an eight year old it's hard++ (especially when you can't sit tall enough to see the monitor. ).  And I said it was the closest to a programming language (at least, I think I did..) I'd ever attempted.  I didn't know what VB was, what C was, I just assumed computers were magical boxes that knew everything for themselves.  And the transition from HTML to XHTML was difficult for me because encorporating Javascript (I forgot to mention I knew javascript in-depth for a couple years.. I forgot about it/don't care about it anymore) was suddenly difficult to do without the W3 validator ringing errors and my website arbitrarily pissing.  It was also not being able to use "width=" and "height=" and some other things, but that was an easy incorporation.

I've seen a LOT of tags and properties, but none of them would ever be of ANY use to me so I didn't bother committing them to memory.  I'm sure there are some I've never seen -- the W3C is making HTML 4.0.1(2?) and adding new tags and stuff.

[Sidoh]

It literally takes two weeks or less to learn HTML and CSS.  They're not even programming languages... they're markup languages.  I'm not trying to bash on you or anything, it's just the way I see it.  The transition from XHTML to HTML is nearly painless.  You close all your tags in the correct order, make sure that tags that don't have close tags are appended with a slash anyway and that's pretty much all you need to know.

I remember every HTML tag and CSS property I've learned too, but that doesn't mean there's more that I've accidentally forgotten about or never discovered.  If you look deeply enough, I bet you'll find a lot of CSS properties you've never even heard of.

I was eight years old and I really hated computers a lot.  If I tried to learn HTML and CSS now I'm sure I could learn it easily in a month (combined).  You forget, you've been around computers a longer time then I have.  When I started learning I didn't care for computers, I didn't like computers.  So naturally I wouldn't want to spend a LOT of time learning something that I thought I would never ever use in real life.  You're entitled to your own opinion on how easy/hard it is to learn, but all I can say is as an eight year old it's hard++ (especially when you can't sit tall enough to see the monitor. ).  And I said it was the closest to a programming language (at least, I think I did..) I'd ever attempted.  I didn't know what VB was, what C was, I just assumed computers were magical boxes that knew everything for themselves.  And the transition from HTML to XHTML was difficult for me because encorporating Javascript (I forgot to mention I knew javascript in-depth for a couple years.. I forgot about it/don't care about it anymore) was suddenly difficult to do without the W3 validator ringing errors and my website arbitrarily pissing.  It was also not being able to use "width=" and "height=" and some other things, but that was an easy incorporation.

I've seen a LOT of tags and properties, but none of them would ever be of ANY use to me so I didn't bother committing them to memory.  I'm sure there are some I've never seen -- the W3C is making HTML 4.0.1(2?) and adding new tags and stuff.
[/quote]

I taught myself how to play and beat my dad in chess on the computer when I was 5... it just depends on the way you think, I guess.  I suppose that's not a very valid comparison and I don't want to play the "I'm better than you because <X> and <Y> is a stupid argument" game...

Javascript is very useful in some cases.  I never really use it in very large doses, but I regularly make use of some of its functions.

[deadly7]

I taught myself how to play and beat my dad in chess on the computer when I was 5... it just depends on the way you think, I guess.  I suppose that's not a very valid comparison and I don't want to play the "I'm better than you because <X> and <Y> is a stupid argument" game...

Javascript is very useful in some cases.  I never really use it in very large doses, but I regularly make use of some of its functions.

Yeah, I was just like "wtf does chess have to do with learning HTML?"

Javascript IS useful, but now it just angers me.  I blew it out of my brain a while ago.

[Sidoh]

Yeah, I was just like "wtf does chess have to do with learning HTML?"

Javascript IS useful, but now it just angers me.  I blew it out of my brain a while ago.

If you ask me, chess is more complicated than HTML...