Gates Mocks $100 Laptop

[iago]

Full Story About Gates' Comment

Full Story About the Laptop

Basically, MIT built a low-power laptop that uses Linux.  It's designed for people who can't afford a full computer.  To quote Gates, "geez, get a decent computer where you can actually read the text and you’re not sitting there cranking the thing while you're trying to type." 

The laptop itself has features such as a handcrank to power it, which is useful in countries where not everybody has access to electricity. 

I personally think it's a very good idea. 

[GameSnake]

Very cool. I think thats a great idea. Even if the computer may not be so poweful, you're spreading technology to those who would otherwise not get exposure to it.

[Sidoh]

As long as their market target isn't the US, I think it's a good idea.  How efficient is the hand crank?  How long do you have to crank it to get, say, 10 minutes of useage?

[iago]

I'm not sure, it might say somewhere on the site. 

I think it targets a smaller market in the US.  There are still poor people in the US (otherwise known as students)

[Warrior]

..I thought he was joking about the handcrank...ROFL!!

[Sidoh]

I'm not sure, it might say somewhere on the site. 

I think it targets a smaller market in the US.  There are still poor people in the US (otherwise known as students)

I think there are much more practical models that students in the US would buy.  I completely agree this has use in, say, classrooms in Costa Rica where they don't even have sewage/running water.

..I thought he was joking about the handcrank...ROFL!!

Lmao...

[iago]

..I thought he was joking about the handcrank...ROFL!!

What's wrong with that?  I thought that was one of their betters idea.  We have hand-crank a powered flashlight and a radio, and they are extremely useful for camping and during power-failures.  Putting in a laptop designed for people that don't have power is a great idea. 

I think there are much more practical models that students in the US would buy.  I completely agree this has use in, say, classrooms in Costa Rica where they don't even have sewage/running water.

I definitely would have bought one if it was decent hardware.  A couple years back I was looking for a cheap laptop that I could take to school and not worry about if it got damaged.  That would have been perfect. 

[Warrior]

Cmon, people want a laptop but don't have power? Perhaps instead of shoving a laptop in their hands they can use the $100 people will pay and help them with more important things like power..

[Sidoh]

I definitely would have bought one if it was decent hardware.  A couple years back I was looking for a cheap laptop that I could take to school and not worry about if it got damaged.  That would have been perfect. 

I definitely see the use, but I, personally, would still rather own/use a powerful laptop for school.

Cmon, people want a laptop but don't have power? Perhaps instead of shoving a laptop in their hands they can use the $100 people will pay and help them with more important things like power..

Look at the above example I gave.  Don't you think computers are useful in a classroom environment?  What about the schools that can't afford normal computers?  Sure, it's not a "cutting edge" project, but that doesn't mean it isn't an innovative/good idea.

[zorm]

Consider for a moment that if they lack power it also means they lack internet. They probably also lack printers because I've yet to hear of a handcrank printer. How useful is a laptop when it doesn't have internet access and there is no printer?

I'm with Warrior on this one that the thousands which would be spent to acquire these laptops could be better spent in providing infastructure and such so that they can eventually get power.

Another note to consider is the literacy rate of the people in such poor countries, I suspect its rather low and as such a laptop won't be all that helpful in furthering education.

[Sidoh]

Consider for a moment that if they lack power it also means they lack internet. They probably also lack printers because I've yet to hear of a handcrank printer. How useful is a laptop when it doesn't have internet access and there is no printer?

Pretty damn useful if what you're doing requires calculations to be done by a computer.  This is a common need in schools.

I'm with Warrior on this one that the thousands which would be spent to acquire these laptops could be better spent in providing infastructure and such so that they can eventually get power.

I don't think the revenue earned from the purchace of these laptops would even come close to covering the price for dropping an optical line down the middle of Nigeria.

Another note to consider is the literacy rate of the people in such poor countries, I suspect its rather low and as such a laptop won't be all that helpful in furthering education.

If that's the case, then they'd be less useful.  However, I have doubts that something like this would even be close to useless.

[zorm]

Pretty damn useful if what you're doing requires calculations to be done by a computer.  This is a common need in schools.

Have an example of something like this? Keep in mind they lack power so I doubt they need it to draw up plans for that skyscaper... Also a TI calculator could serve the same use, while it should be theoretically cheaper to acquire.

I don't think the revenue earned from the purchace of these laptops would even come close to covering the price for dropping an optical line down the middle of Nigeria.

It should be more than enough to start some sort of project be it a powerplant or wiring, etc. Also note that the money to purchase these would likely come from donations by outside sources so it would be just as easy to try and get more money for a more useful purpose.

[ZeroX]

$100 dollars you say? My keyboard and Mouse where more expensive. Damn WTF. And they dont even hold Memory.

[Sidoh]

Have an example of something like this? Keep in mind they lack power so I doubt they need it to draw up plans for that skyscaper... Also a TI calculator could serve the same use, while it should be theoretically cheaper to acquire.

Yeah, that's a pretty good point.  I still think there will be a decent market for these, though.  A TI calculator is certainly more practical in most cases, but they're also less powerful.  Plus, they cost just about as much.

It should be more than enough to start some sort of project be it a powerplant or wiring, etc. Also note that the money to purchase these would likely come from donations by outside sources so it would be just as easy to try and get more money for a more useful purpose.

Honestly, how much money do you think this project is going to pull in?  It cost $11 Million just to pull a few hundred miles of unmuxed T1 lines in Colorado.

[Eric]

hm.. I thought young children were the main target for these "computers."  The idea of a full grown adult sitting there cranking his laptop is humorous to me and I'd imagine it would be quite degrading for the person having to do it.  Picture someone like that sitting next to you in class... or even worse, a business meeting.  The use of man-power to energize small emergency equipment such as flashlights and radios is obviously useful because those things are often kept in storage and only used during emergency situations when light and emergency broadcasting provide a great deal of service.  What are you planning on doing with this computer during such a situation?  Play WoW through your unpowered WiFi router and modem? Calculate taxes?  There's plenty of reasons to hate Gates, but this isn't one of them, iago.

[Eric]

Cmon, people want a laptop but don't have power? Perhaps instead of shoving a laptop in their hands they can use the $100 people will pay and help them with more important things like power..

or books.

[CrAz3D]

But the books on CD & then send a CD with the laptop?

But in all seriousness, foot pedal > hand crank.  It makes WAY more sense, you type with two hands while your feet dangle...use the feet to power.  Hook it up to a hard core geared pedaling system & you could have a good amount of power.

[iago]

hm.. I thought young children were the main target for these "computers."  The idea of a full grown adult sitting there cranking his laptop is humorous to me and I'd imagine it would be quite degrading for the person having to do it.  Picture someone like that sitting next to you in class... or even worse, a business meeting.  The use of man-power to energize small emergency equipment such as flashlights and radios is obviously useful because those things are often kept in storage and only used during emergency situations when light and emergency broadcasting provide a great deal of service.  What are you planning on doing with this computer during such a situation?  Play WoW through your unpowered WiFi router and modem? Calculate taxes?  There's plenty of reasons to hate Gates, but this isn't one of them, iago.

You obviously haven't read everything.  These aren't designed for business men who are in a meeting, these are designed for people in countries where they don't have access to electricity.  They are NOT designed for playing World of Warcraft, obviously. 

Who said anything about hating Gates here?  I think he said something stupid, that's all. 

Cmon, people want a laptop but don't have power? Perhaps instead of shoving a laptop in their hands they can use the $100 people will pay and help them with more important things like power..

or books.

Power is a lot more expensive.  And pressing CDs is faster and cheaper than printing books, so score another point for the little laptops. 

[ZeroX]

But the books on CD & then send a CD with the laptop?

But in all seriousness, foot pedal > hand crank.  It makes WAY more sense, you type with two hands while your feet dangle...use the feet to power.  Hook it up to a hard core geared pedaling system & you could have a good amount of power.

I think the whole idea of using self generate power is retarded. Why waste all that engery in pedaling and cranking while you can be doing better things? Like helping your economy out. Damn North korea.

[Sidoh]

I think the whole idea of using self generate power is retarded. Why waste all that engery in pedaling and cranking while you can be doing better things? Like helping your economy out. Damn North korea.

Ah.  So you can't see any value in learning material that could be displayed by these laptops?  You want third world countries to stay in the state their in?

[Warrior]

Cmon, people want a laptop but don't have power? Perhaps instead of shoving a laptop in their hands they can use the $100 people will pay and help them with more important things like power..

Look at the above example I gave.  Don't you think computers are useful in a classroom environment?  What about the schools that can't afford normal computers?  Sure, it's not a "cutting edge" project, but that doesn't mean it isn't an innovative/good idea.

No but if they are so "third world" then perhaps we should invest more money into giving them basic necessities before we even think about laptops. Maybe attack the problem at the root, perhaps how the government of theirs is run, rebuilding whatever economy they have left, etc.

[Sidoh]

No but if they are so "third world" then perhaps we should invest more money into giving them basic necessities before we even think about laptops. Maybe attack the problem at the root, perhaps how the government of theirs is run, rebuilding whatever economy they have left, etc.

Who said they or their government has to pay for them?

[zorm]

Yeah, that's a pretty good point.  I still think there will be a decent market for these, though.  A TI calculator is certainly more practical in most cases, but they're also less powerful.  Plus, they cost just about as much.

Yeah thats the whole good deal and such part about using TI calculators, I can't imagine they actually cost $100 to produce where as I'm rather sure this laptop is being sold at cost.

Honestly, how much money do you think this project is going to pull in?  It cost $11 Million just to pull a few hundred miles of unmuxed T1 lines in Colorado.

I did a quick google search and as near as I can tell the cost of laying fiber depends on the location. Consider the fact that an undeveloped country won't have tons of underground things so laying fiber should be insanely cheap.

To me having internet access and a real laptop would be a million times more useful than having 30 laptops that require handcranking...

[CrAz3D]

No but if they are so "third world" then perhaps we should invest more money into giving them basic necessities before we even think about laptops. Maybe attack the problem at the root, perhaps how the government of theirs is run, rebuilding whatever economy they have left, etc.

Who said they or their government has to pay for them?

Question isn't who pays, but more of a "wouldn't it be better to give them food?" kind of a thing.

[Warrior]

I didn't, could be other things associated with their government. For example, take Saddam when he dictated iraq, due to the way he lead the country, the people suffered from less than adequate nutrition and things like mass murders and raping.

[Sidoh]

I'd be interested to see actual figures, Zorm.

Who says we can't buy them a few of these and food?

[iago]

One of the reasons that the countries are poor (among other things, of course) is lack of education.  With laptops, the students will be exposed to books, and will have the opportunity to educate themselves.  Extra education would be a good thing, because when they grow up they will know enough to get or create a real job instead of just starving. 

Like I said, binding books is expensive, but pressing CDs is cheap. 

No but if they are so "third world" then perhaps we should invest more money into giving them basic necessities before we even think about laptops. Maybe attack the problem at the root, perhaps how the government of theirs is run, rebuilding whatever economy they have left, etc.

How are they going to overthrow their government if they don't understand what the problem is?  And how are they going to understand it without proper education?

Sure, there's the option of another country "liberating" them from their government.  But I would argue that the best way for a country to change its government is for its own citizens to overthrow it.  After all, the citizens know what they want more than a country across the ocean does. 

[Warrior]

No but if they are so "third world" then perhaps we should invest more money into giving them basic necessities before we even think about laptops. Maybe attack the problem at the root, perhaps how the government of theirs is run, rebuilding whatever economy they have left, etc.

How are they going to overthrow their government if they don't understand what the problem is?  And how are they going to understand it without proper education?

Sure, there's the option of another country "liberating" them from their government.  But I would argue that the best way for a country to change its government is for its own citizens to overthrow it.  After all, the citizens know what they want more than a country across the ocean does. 

[/quote]

The countries trying to help them should do the overthrowing, I mean if they REALLY want to help. Not give them some jack in the box laptop and expect them to automaticly become educated.

[Sidoh]

The countries trying to help them should do the overthrowing, I mean if they REALLY want to help. Not give them some jack in the box laptop and expect them to automaticly become educated.

Show me somewhere where anyone said these would automatically educate anyone.  You must agree that computers are a useful aid in the education process.

[MyndFyre]

How are they going to overthrow their government if they don't understand what the problem is?  And how are they going to understand it without proper education?

Sure, there's the option of another country "liberating" them from their government.  But I would argue that the best way for a country to change its government is for its own citizens to overthrow it.  After all, the citizens know what they want more than a country across the ocean does. 

We shouldn't get confused about how overthrowing duing the liberal revolution was and overthrowing now would be.  The US overthrew the British tyrants during the liberal (Locke) revolution, when they already had the ability to read and criticize government.  Comparing Fidel Castro or Saddam Hussein to the 17th and 18th century kings of England would be like comparing Adolf Hitler to Mohatma Ghandi.

[Warrior]

The countries trying to help them should do the overthrowing, I mean if they REALLY want to help. Not give them some jack in the box laptop and expect them to automaticly become educated.

Show me somewhere where anyone said these would automatically educate anyone.  You must agree that computers are a useful aid in the education process.

Alright then what are they used for? Oh I get it, maybe we can crank it up for a while and play CS Source or something!
What a dumb idea.

[Sidoh]

Alright then what are they used for? Oh I get it, maybe we can crank it up for a while and play CS Source or something!
What a dumb idea.

No, Warrior.  You said something about someone saying these laptops are going to "automatically" educate underprivilaged people:

[...] and expect them to automaticly become educated.

I was responding to that.

[iago]

Warrior -- go away, your posts are unwelcome in this thread. 

We shouldn't get confused about how overthrowing duing the liberal revolution was and overthrowing now would be.  The US overthrew the British tyrants during the liberal (Locke) revolution, when they already had the ability to read and criticize government.  Comparing Fidel Castro or Saddam Hussein to the 17th and 18th century kings of England would be like comparing Adolf Hitler to Mohatma Ghandi.

I don't know a lot about the US revolution, or whatever it's callled.  What I do know is that, particularly in a totalitarian society, the greatest weapon against the government is education.  People who are living there do not realize that there is a better way to live.  Hopefully, the computers can give them access to books, and books would allow them to expand their minds. 

I am not sure about the US revolution, to be sure, but I just finished reading a book about a fictional revolution where they threw out their old patrician, who was an evil man, and established another patrician, who was at least as evil.  But the point was that they did it themselves, and I think that that is very important in a revolution. 

[Sidoh]

Coincidentally, Cnet has this movie up on their RSS feed:

http://news.com.com/1606-2_3-6051192.html?part=rss&tag=6051192&subj=news

It sounds like a pretty good discussion.

[Warrior]

Alright then what are they used for? Oh I get it, maybe we can crank it up for a while and play CS Source or something!
What a dumb idea.

No, Warrior.  You said something about someone saying these laptops are going to "automatically" educate underprivilaged people:

I admitted I made an assumption, so I'm asking what other practical uses might they have?
I still think this is a bad idea, it's good to make an affordable laptop for the world sure but I'm saying the money is better spent elsewhere.

Additionally do people in thirdworld countries really have money to throw at a laptop? I mean from a statistic I saw (I think I can still cite it if needed) some people in africa make 400 a year..that's not something they'd like to throw away that easily. This has a good intention but again, could be used in a better way.

[iago]

Alright then what are they used for? Oh I get it, maybe we can crank it up for a while and play CS Source or something!
What a dumb idea.

No, Warrior.  You said something about someone saying these laptops are going to "automatically" educate underprivilaged people:

I admitted I made an assumption, so I'm asking what other practical uses might they have?
I still think this is a bad idea, it's good to make an affordable laptop for the world sure but I'm saying the money is better spent elsewhere.

Additionally do people in thirdworld countries really have money to throw at a laptop? I mean from a statistic I saw (I think I can still cite it if needed) some people in africa make 400 a year..that's not something they'd like to throw away that easily. This has a good intention but again, could be used in a better way.

Perhaps they can spend money elsewhere, or perhaps they can spend it to buy a laptop to help educate their children.  Don't forget that charity organizations would be able to provide these, too.  And don't forget American or Canadian public schools. 

The point is, they now have a choice.  That's more than they had before. 

[Sidoh]

I admitted I made an assumption, so I'm asking what other practical uses might they have?
I still think this is a bad idea, it's good to make an affordable laptop for the world sure but I'm saying the money is better spent elsewhere.

This may be true, but I still think it's a wonderful idea, given the funding is proficient.

Additionally do people in thirdworld countries really have money to throw at a laptop? I mean from a statistic I saw (I think I can still cite it if needed) some people in africa make 400 a year..that's not something they'd like to throw away that easily. This has a good intention but again, could be used in a better way.

I really doubt that they're going to pay for the laptops.  I think it's far more likely rich governments will buy them in order to offer them as donations.

[Warrior]

I admitted I made an assumption, so I'm asking what other practical uses might they have?
I still think this is a bad idea, it's good to make an affordable laptop for the world sure but I'm saying the money is better spent elsewhere.

This may be true, but I still think it's a wonderful idea, given the funding is proficient.

I'll agree it would be better to have THAT instead of nothing at all, oh well.

Additionally do people in thirdworld countries really have money to throw at a laptop? I mean from a statistic I saw (I think I can still cite it if needed) some people in africa make 400 a year..that's not something they'd like to throw away that easily. This has a good intention but again, could be used in a better way.

I really doubt that they're going to pay for the laptops.  I think it's far more likely rich governments will buy them in order to offer them as donations.

Yea that does make sense, I guess I just think those "rich governments" can help people more by providing everyday necessities.
Like I said, atleast they are trying to make something that's affordable. That's commendable atleast.

[Sidoh]

I'll agree it would be better to have THAT instead of nothing at all, oh well.

Hehe, yeah.

Yea that does make sense, I guess I just think those "rich governments" can help people more by providing everyday necessities.
Like I said, atleast they are trying to make something that's affordable. That's commendable atleast.

I definitely agree.  If they're shipping $100 laptops to underprivileged countries in place of commodities, they'd be really, really stupid.  Hopefully that will never be the case, though.

[ZeroX]

I'll agree it would be better to have THAT instead of nothing at all, oh well.

Hehe, yeah.

Yea that does make sense, I guess I just think those "rich governments" can help people more by providing everyday necessities.
Like I said, atleast they are trying to make something that's affordable. That's commendable atleast.

I definitely agree.  If they're shipping $100 laptops to underprivileged countries in place of commodities, they'd be really, really stupid.  Hopefully that will never be the case, though.

You never know. They just might horde the laptops and use them for their own educational purposes. I personally think they will never get to the kids? I dont know, just trying to think of all situtions?

[Sidoh]

You never know. They just might horde the laptops and use them for their own educational purposes. I personally think they will never get to the kids? I dont know, just trying to think of all situtions?

Who's going to horde the laptops?  The students at MIT?  They're going to get out of school making 6 figures a year -- they're not going to be hording $100 laptops for their own use.

[ZeroX]

You never know. They just might horde the laptops and use them for their own educational purposes. I personally think they will never get to the kids? I dont know, just trying to think of all situtions?

Who's going to horde the laptops?  The students at MIT?  They're going to get out of school making 6 figures a year -- they're not going to be hording $100 laptops for their own use.

No, I mean the goverments of those said countries that are going to be getting the laptops.

[Sidoh]

No, I mean the goverments of those said countries that are going to be getting the laptops.

Same deal.  The government is probalby wealthy enough to sustain their physical needs.  Besides, I don't think very many governments are that corrupt.

[ZeroX]

No, I mean the goverments of those said countries that are going to be getting the laptops.

Same deal.  The government is probalby wealthy enough to sustain their physical needs.  Besides, I don't think very many governments are that corrupt.

Minus the USA right 

[Sidoh]

Minus the USA right 

I don't think any sort of US government official would get any sort of use out of one of these.  Do you honestly think that the US technology is inferior to these?

[ZeroX]

Minus the USA right 

I don't think any sort of US government official would get any sort of use out of one of these.  Do you honestly think that the US technology is inferior to these?

I was talking about the corrupt part 

Besides, I don't think very many governments are that corrupt.

[Sidoh]

I was talking about the corrupt part 

We were talking about the laptops, remember?