Author Topic: NTFS Driver  (Read 9640 times)

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Offline rabbit

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NTFS Driver
« on: July 17, 2006, 06:53:58 pm »

Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2006, 07:20:42 pm »
http://developers.slashdot.org/developers/06/07/15/1346250.shtml
Huzzah!  Writeable NTFS at last.

Hasn't this been the case for a while?  For some reason, I thought that another one I was looking at a few months ago had the ability to write.  I could (and probably did) misread something, though.

If that's the case, cool! :D

Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2006, 07:27:42 pm »
It's had limited write capability for awhile.  You could write to files, but you couldn't create files or change the size of files. 

Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2006, 07:28:14 pm »
It's had limited write capability for awhile.  You could write to files, but you couldn't create files or change the size of files. 

Aah, okay.  Well then, good news! :D

Offline Warrior

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2006, 04:14:11 pm »
Nice, shows just how determined you guys are. Now maybe you can drop your crappy FSes.
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Offline Newby

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2006, 04:23:53 pm »
Nice, shows just how determined you guys are. Now maybe you can drop your crappy FSes.

Kinda like M$ dropping WinFS? ;)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2006, 04:27:26 pm by Newby »
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[17:32:45] * xar sets mode: -oooooooooo algorithm ban chris cipher newby stdio TehUser tnarongi|away vursed warz
[17:32:54] * xar sets mode: +o newby
[17:32:58] <xar> new rule
[17:33:02] <xar> me and newby rule all

I'd bet that you're currently bloated like a water ballon on a hot summer's day.

That analogy doesn't even make sense.  Why would a water balloon be especially bloated on a hot summer's day? For your sake, I hope there wasn't too much logic testing on your LSAT. 

Offline Chavo

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2006, 04:50:01 pm »
Anyone know if this would allow you to install Linux to an ntfs partition (I don't see why not).  Would be nice to do for dual booters since linux file system editors for windows aren't exactly ideal.

Offline Newby

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2006, 04:53:08 pm »
I would not install it on a filesystem. IIRC it's not a kernel driver and IIRC it's nowhere ready to be a kernel replacement driver. Heh.

It's still beta ffs. :P
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[17:32:45] * xar sets mode: -oooooooooo algorithm ban chris cipher newby stdio TehUser tnarongi|away vursed warz
[17:32:54] * xar sets mode: +o newby
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[17:33:02] <xar> me and newby rule all

I'd bet that you're currently bloated like a water ballon on a hot summer's day.

That analogy doesn't even make sense.  Why would a water balloon be especially bloated on a hot summer's day? For your sake, I hope there wasn't too much logic testing on your LSAT. 

Offline MyndFyre

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2006, 05:55:07 pm »
I would not install it on a filesystem. IIRC it's not a kernel driver and IIRC it's nowhere ready to be a kernel replacement driver. Heh.

It's still beta ffs. :P
Psh, everything related to Linux is eternally in beta.

It's not ready to be a replacement driver because you guys use pussy permissions (owner, everyone else, root at read, write, execute).  NTFS granular permissions ftw!
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Offline Chavo

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2006, 06:05:16 pm »
I would not install it on a filesystem. IIRC it's not a kernel driver and IIRC it's nowhere ready to be a kernel replacement driver. Heh.

It's still beta ffs. :P
I'm not an idiot ;)  I have no intention of installing an OS on a beta file system.  I just don't know enough about the linux architecture to know whether it is possible for it to install on a non ext2/3/reiser file system.

Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2006, 07:45:29 pm »
Psh, everything related to Linux is eternally in beta.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: that's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard, even if it is a joke. 

That's the same as saying that nothing made by Microsoft works at all. 

The vast majority of software has a stable version and a beta version/head.  I actually can't think of anything I use that doesn't have a stable (non-beta) version. 

Offline MyndFyre

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2006, 07:49:50 pm »
Psh, everything related to Linux is eternally in beta.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: that's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard, even if it is a joke. 
Well, maybe I should move it to general discussion, since after all, I found it funny.
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Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2006, 08:01:45 pm »
Psh, everything related to Linux is eternally in beta.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: that's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard, even if it is a joke. 
Well, maybe I should move it to general discussion, since after all, I found it funny.
If it makes you happy, feel free to split off that post and move it to general.  As for the thread itself, the owner posted it in here, and I'm happy to oblige his wishes. 

Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2006, 08:38:48 pm »
Nice, shows just how determined you guys are. Now maybe you can drop your crappy FSes.

Heh, to be honest, I don't think a sane network administrator could use something with permissions as simple as the standard Linux FS's I've used (ext2/3).  Not to say I think ext2/3 are crappy file systems, but they're just not practical or robust enough for a huge network.

Offline rabbit

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2006, 10:12:52 pm »
And yet the internet is hosted primarily on Linux machines... ???

It would appear they work just fine for global networks.  Well, that's only in practice...I'm not sure how it would work in theory though.

Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2006, 11:38:55 pm »
And yet the internet is hosted primarily on Linux machines... ???

It would appear they work just fine for global networks.  Well, that's only in practice...I'm not sure how it would work in theory though.
"In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they are not."

Heh, to be honest, I don't think a sane network administrator could use something with permissions as simple as the standard Linux FS's I've used (ext2/3).  Not to say I think ext2/3 are crappy file systems, but they're just not practical or robust enough for a huge network.
I don't quite know how you figure that.  Besides what's already been said, the best permissions are the simplest, the ones where it's most difficult to make mistakes.  There's a huge problem on Windows of people not understanding the permissions because they're so complicated, whereas Linux permissions make it easy.  It's Occam's Razor all over again: simpler is often the most effective.  I've never found myself limited. 

Of course, that's an entirely different argument. 

Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2006, 11:59:10 pm »
And yet the internet is hosted primarily on Linux machines... ???

It would appear they work just fine for global networks.  Well, that's only in practice...I'm not sure how it would work in theory though.

I'm talking about a multi-user network on a domain, not the internet where almost everything is accessed from one local account.

I don't quite know how you figure that.  Besides what's already been said, the best permissions are the simplest, the ones where it's most difficult to make mistakes.  There's a huge problem on Windows of people not understanding the permissions because they're so complicated, whereas Linux permissions make it easy.  It's Occam's Razor all over again: simpler is often the most effective.  I've never found myself limited. 

That's wrong.  "The best file system" is totally dependant on the situation.  I'm not saying Linux file systems aren't viable solutions for some situations, but I am saying that NTFS is better for a domain with a lot of users (my school district has 800 or so and I can't imagine using anything else.  it would be such a pain!)

I think you're confusing 'complexity' with 'versatility.'  Trust me, it's not hard to fix permission issues on Windows servers.  I've been doing it for the last week.  We're restructuring our entire server structure (converting 'building servers' into 'role servers,' which is much more sensible now that all the servers are located in a single location).  NTFS (not to mention active directory and all of the other server management tools that come standard with 2003 server) have the features they do for a reason: people use them.  They don't add in extra fluff to make things more difficult for admins.

Of course, that's an entirely different argument. 
« Last Edit: July 19, 2006, 02:49:17 am by Sidoh »

Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #17 on: July 19, 2006, 08:15:21 am »
My University has 25,000 users, who are all on UNIX.  That seems to work out pretty well. 

Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2006, 11:32:08 am »
My University has 25,000 users, who are all on UNIX.  That seems to work out pretty well. 

Every single one of your servers were *NIX?  I seem to remember you telling me that you had a Windows box for Active Directory.

Arguing with you about Linux/anything to do with Linux/the way you use computers is about as annoying as arguing with Warrior about Microsoft.  ::)  (I'm kidding :P)

Offline Warrior

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2006, 05:30:00 pm »
I was originally kidding. However this is a good contribution.
One must ask oneself: "do I will trolling to become a universal law?" And then when one realizes "yes, I do will it to be such," one feels completely justified.
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Offline iago

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2006, 05:47:16 pm »
My University has 25,000 users, who are all on UNIX.  That seems to work out pretty well. 

Every single one of your servers were *NIX?  I seem to remember you telling me that you had a Windows box for Active Directory.

Arguing with you about Linux/anything to do with Linux/the way you use computers is about as annoying as arguing with Warrior about Microsoft.  ::)  (I'm kidding :P)
Sorry, I missed this post. 

Yes, there are 25,000 UNIX users on a single cluster of servers.  There's about a dozen servers, and your files/settings/everything are constant across them. 

There are also windows workstations.  But the email and all that kind of stuff goes through UNIX. 

Offline Warrior

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2006, 05:49:45 pm »
I'm not familiar with neither set of permissions (Really, I never cared for them) but what are the other obvious advantages to having NTFS? Is it just to ease the pain of transfer from Windows to Linux? If this would be converted into a kernel driver what advantages would the FS bring over say ext3?
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Offline Joe

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #22 on: July 21, 2006, 06:01:07 pm »
Psh, everything related to Linux is eternally in beta.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: that's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard, even if it is a joke. 

That's the same as saying that nothing made by Microsoft works at all. 

The vast majority of software has a stable version and a beta version/head.  I actually can't think of anything I use that doesn't have a stable (non-beta) version. 

You've never used any of my software, I guess.
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You might be right about that, Joe.


Offline Sidoh

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #23 on: July 21, 2006, 06:36:24 pm »
Sorry, I missed this post. 

Yes, there are 25,000 UNIX users on a single cluster of servers.  There's about a dozen servers, and your files/settings/everything are constant across them. 

There are also windows workstations.  But the email and all that kind of stuff goes through UNIX. 

This is a domain?  I can't imagine samba emulating AD is anywhere near as robust or stable as AD itself. :P

Offline Newby

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #24 on: July 21, 2006, 07:19:45 pm »
You've never used any of my software, I guess.

I think only you have used your software.

iago is talking about software used in the real world that is stable and not extremely buggy. :P
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Quote
[17:32:45] * xar sets mode: -oooooooooo algorithm ban chris cipher newby stdio TehUser tnarongi|away vursed warz
[17:32:54] * xar sets mode: +o newby
[17:32:58] <xar> new rule
[17:33:02] <xar> me and newby rule all

I'd bet that you're currently bloated like a water ballon on a hot summer's day.

That analogy doesn't even make sense.  Why would a water balloon be especially bloated on a hot summer's day? For your sake, I hope there wasn't too much logic testing on your LSAT. 

Offline deadly7

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Re: NTFS Driver
« Reply #25 on: July 21, 2006, 09:54:48 pm »
You've never used any of my software, I guess.

I think only you have used your software.

iago is talking about software used in the real world that is stable and not extremely buggy. :P
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