Author Topic: Regarding a topic...  (Read 16568 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline rabbit

  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8092
  • I speak for the entire clan (except Joe)
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2007, 07:42:03 am »
"Other drugs aren't pushed to be legal" is bullshit.  Morphine (refined form of heroin) is legal and widely used.  Novocaine (refined form of cocaine) is legal and widely used.  Marijuana has no medical purpose, nor do any of it's derivatives (don't say glaucoma, as there are hundreds of brands of beta blockers that all work BETTER than marijuana).

Offline d&q

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1427
  • I'm here.
    • View Profile
    • Site
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #31 on: March 03, 2007, 10:01:11 am »
Morphine is not a refined form of Heroin...in fact, you could say it's the other way around, as heroin breaks down into morphine in your liver. Morphine is ridiculously addictive, and I'm staunchly opposed it. It, along with heroin, has ruined the lives of many people.
The writ of the founders must endure.

Offline iago

  • Leader
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17914
  • Fnord.
    • View Profile
    • SkullSecurity
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2007, 10:41:20 am »
Morphine is not a refined form of Heroin...in fact, you could say it's the other way around, as heroin breaks down into morphine in your liver. Morphine is ridiculously addictive, and I'm staunchly opposed it. It, along with heroin, has ruined the lives of many people.
A friend of a friend is old, riddled with arthritis, can barely walk, and will never improve. Are you opposed with letting her ease her pain with Morphine until she dies? Taking a heavy painkiller is the only way to ensure she doesn't live out her years in agony.

And incidentally, they didn't give her morphine, they gave her another highly addictive pain killer. Oxy-something, I think. But I still support that in this case.

Offline deadly7

  • 42
  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6496
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2007, 11:27:40 am »
Morphine is not a refined form of Heroin...in fact, you could say it's the other way around, as heroin breaks down into morphine in your liver. Morphine is ridiculously addictive, and I'm staunchly opposed it. It, along with heroin, has ruined the lives of many people.
A friend of a friend is old, riddled with arthritis, can barely walk, and will never improve. Are you opposed with letting her ease her pain with Morphine until she dies? Taking a heavy painkiller is the only way to ensure she doesn't live out her years in agony.

And incidentally, they didn't give her morphine, they gave her another highly addictive pain killer. Oxy-something, I think. But I still support that in this case.
Oxycodone.
[17:42:21.609] <Ergot> Kutsuju you're girlfrieds pussy must be a 403 error for you
 [17:42:25.585] <Ergot> FORBIDDEN

on IRC playing T&T++
<iago> He is unarmed
<Hitmen> he has no arms?!

on AIM with a drunk mythix:
(00:50:05) Mythix: Deadly
(00:50:11) Mythix: I'm going to fuck that red dot out of your head.
(00:50:15) Mythix: with my nine

Offline Armin

  • Honorary Leader
  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2480
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2007, 01:41:54 pm »
"Other drugs aren't pushed to be legal" is bullshit.  Morphine (refined form of heroin) is legal and widely used.  Novocaine (refined form of cocaine) is legal and widely used.  Marijuana has no medical purpose, nor do any of it's derivatives (don't say glaucoma, as there are hundreds of brands of beta blockers that all work BETTER than marijuana).
Marijuana would play a great role for cancer patients.
Hitmen: art is gay

Offline dark_drake

  • Mufasa was 10x the lion Simba was.
  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Dun dun dun
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2007, 01:53:17 pm »
The active ingredient in marijuana is THC, right? As far as I know, there is a pill form of that available.  Why don't people take that instead of smoking marijuana?
errr... something like that...

Offline d&q

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1427
  • I'm here.
    • View Profile
    • Site
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2007, 02:11:23 pm »
Morphine is not a refined form of Heroin...in fact, you could say it's the other way around, as heroin breaks down into morphine in your liver. Morphine is ridiculously addictive, and I'm staunchly opposed it. It, along with heroin, has ruined the lives of many people.
A friend of a friend is old, riddled with arthritis, can barely walk, and will never improve. Are you opposed with letting her ease her pain with Morphine until she dies? Taking a heavy painkiller is the only way to ensure she doesn't live out her years in agony.

And incidentally, they didn't give her morphine, they gave her another highly addictive pain killer. Oxy-something, I think. But I still support that in this case.

Like you said, there are alternatives. If there is no other possible option, then yes, I would support its use. However, morphine is highly abused and more often than not, there are alternatives.
The writ of the founders must endure.

Offline Armin

  • Honorary Leader
  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2480
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2007, 02:19:50 pm »
The active ingredient in marijuana is THC, right? As far as I know, there is a pill form of that available.  Why don't people take that instead of smoking marijuana?
Smoking marijuana will allow the user to choose the perfect dosage they would need for the occasion. Not to mention that if smoked with a vaporizer, Marijuana smoke would be virtually harmless.
Hitmen: art is gay

Offline rabbit

  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8092
  • I speak for the entire clan (except Joe)
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2007, 03:09:49 pm »
"Other drugs aren't pushed to be legal" is bullshit.  Morphine (refined form of heroin) is legal and widely used.  Novocaine (refined form of cocaine) is legal and widely used.  Marijuana has no medical purpose, nor do any of it's derivatives (don't say glaucoma, as there are hundreds of brands of beta blockers that all work BETTER than marijuana).
Marijuana would play a great role for cancer patients.
Says who?

Offline iago

  • Leader
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17914
  • Fnord.
    • View Profile
    • SkullSecurity
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2007, 03:13:54 pm »
Like you said, there are alternatives. If there is no other possible option, then yes, I would support its use. However, morphine is highly abused and more often than not, there are alternatives.
That's fine, I just wanted to show you that there are cases where it's useful. I'm not going to argue whether or not it should be legal/etc, because I don't know enough about it and really, I don't care. I'll leave the pharmaceutical stuff to pharmacists/doctors, and let them leave the computer stuff to me :)

Offline Armin

  • Honorary Leader
  • x86
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2480
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2007, 03:26:13 pm »
"Other drugs aren't pushed to be legal" is bullshit.  Morphine (refined form of heroin) is legal and widely used.  Novocaine (refined form of cocaine) is legal and widely used.  Marijuana has no medical purpose, nor do any of it's derivatives (don't say glaucoma, as there are hundreds of brands of beta blockers that all work BETTER than marijuana).
Marijuana would play a great role for cancer patients.
Says who?
Quote
Medical marijuana is one of the most widely supported issues in drug policy reform. Numerous published studies suggest that marijuana has medical value in treating patients with serious illnesses such as AIDS, glaucoma, cancer, multiple sclerosis, epilepsy, and chronic pain. In 1999, the Institute of Medicine, in the most comprehensive study of medical marijuana's efficacy to date, concluded, "Nausea, appetite loss, pain and anxiety . . . all can be mitigated by marijuana." Allowing patients legal access to medical marijuana has been discussed by numerous organizations, including the AIDS Action Council, American Bar Association, American Public Health Association, California Medical Association, National Association of Attorneys General, and several state nurses associations.
Under the "Public Support" section here.
Hitmen: art is gay

Offline cheeseisfun

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2007, 05:45:35 pm »
The active ingredient in marijuana is THC, right? As far as I know, there is a pill form of that available.  Why don't people take that instead of smoking marijuana?

Here's the thing. You are thinking of Marinol, which is actually synthetic THC. The problem with Marinol (and I think there's another one out there too) is that smoking Cannabis actually is more efficient, as well as the fact that the THC is not synthetic. Marinol's synthetic THC actually can CAUSE nausia and anxiety, and paranoia. Real THC actually can counter those effects. Yes, Cannabis Sativa (as opposed to Cannabis Indica) can actually cause paranoia to unexperienced users (it gives a cerebral head high, sometimes a bit trippy). Rule said that Cannabis causes paranoia to users... this is not always true, and it's only during the time that THC is active in one's bloodstream (1-4 hours, depending on the user's tolerance). Also, the paranoia that is caused isn't ever the kind of paranoia that would cause people to think that there is a government conspiracy. It's actually more of a "shit, my heart is pounding too fast, am I going to have a heart attack? Is there somebody looking at me through the window?" kind of stuff. I've experienced the paranoia before, and it's actually nothing to be worried about, since Cannabis plays a lot of mind games while one is under the influence. Cannabis Indica strains are very good for medicinal usage, as it produces a body stone that dulls pain. Cannabis plays a great role for cancer patients because THC (with good levels of CBD, since CBD (cannabidiol) regulates the levels of THC (CBD is not psychoactive)) can counter-act the nausia caused by chemo therapy. There are many medicinal uses for Cannabis, not just to help cancer patients. There is a huge medicinal marijuana movement, and there is still research going on for other things that Cannabis can do. Currently there's a study going on that says that Cannabis can possibly help prevent Alzheimer's as well.. this has not been proven yet, but given time, we will see.

Rule, I'm surprised that you still think Cannabis is a bad drug that is dangerous. I gave you many links that show all the common myths of Cannabis, all of which have been proven wrong by scientific studies. And yes, it is true that the government is trying to cover up the research that has been/is being done. Read the "Why Marijuana is Illegal" link that I posted.

Cannabis is not a bad drug, and recreational use has little to no bad effects on its users.

1. It's not physically addictive.
2. It has no bad physiological effects (except if you smoke it, you could get a cough).
3. Has no potential for overdose.

So why should it be illegal? Prohibition only causes:

1. No quality control, thus things can be laced with other drugs.
2. No quality control of Cannabis means that people could get bad Cannabis, with mold on it, that can actually be detrimental to one's physical health.
3. Causes organized crime to rise.

What happened with Alcohol prohibition? I think we all know the story.
Marijuana is a VERY safe drug. It's more safe that A LOT of legal prescription drugs.
Adderral? You can OD. It's addictive, too!
Oxycodone/Oxycontin/Morphine/etc? Very high OD risk, and it's highly addictive. And yet it's being abused by so many people. I don't think it should be illegal, because many people need chronic pain killers. But Cannabis can also kill chronic pain, with NONE of those risk factors.

I'm getting tired of typing now. I don't see what else I need to say to get you non-believers to understand that Cannabis is a drug that needs to be freed.

About Tobacco...
Tobacco alone, without any of the additives, is not nearly as harmful as people think. Tobacco companies add extra nicotine (which is actually a poison), and many other chemicals which are supposed to help smooth the smoke out (and keep people addicted). Many of those can be carcinogenic. Tobacco alone is still bad, though.

Hopefully now you know that just because something is illegal, does not mean it is bad. Later.

P.S. Rule, I think it's funny how you say it's impossible to prove anything in the real world, and then you list many things that smoke in one's lungs can cause. All of those problems were found out by scientific studies, and yet since it was included in your argument, it did not apply to your idea that you cannot prove anything in science. But I guess it doesn't matter, since you're right about smoke causing those problems. Also, the study of medicine is a very scientific thing. But I guess that doesn't matter, since it's part of your argument, and not someone else's, right?
« Last Edit: March 03, 2007, 06:12:21 pm by cheeseisfun »

Offline Super_X

  • I suck.
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1340
  • I suck!
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2007, 06:28:33 pm »
And, SuperX, your comment claiming that one shouldn't care about things that don't directly effect him/her sounds really selfish.  I'm not used to talking to people like you. 
I don't quite understand why it's selfish to let people do what they want with their lives. I'm not saying "Don't judge me. It's my life." I'm saying that every one has the right to live their life like they want, I think it's selfish to take away their privileges because you don't agree.

Offline iago

  • Leader
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17914
  • Fnord.
    • View Profile
    • SkullSecurity
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2007, 06:34:32 pm »
And, SuperX, your comment claiming that one shouldn't care about things that don't directly effect him/her sounds really selfish.  I'm not used to talking to people like you. 
I don't quite understand why it's selfish to let people do what they want with their lives. I'm not saying "Don't judge me. It's my life." I'm saying that every one has the right to live their life like they want, I think it's selfish to take away their privileges because you don't agree.
Who's taking away privileges? That was done a long time ago when the law was made. All that's happening here is he's giving some advice, and while I think people should have every right to do things that can hurt themselves, I also think it's everybody's right (responsibility, even) to tell somebody when they're doing something stupid/harmful.

Offline Super_X

  • I suck.
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1340
  • I suck!
    • View Profile
Re: Regarding a topic...
« Reply #44 on: March 03, 2007, 07:28:12 pm »
And, SuperX, your comment claiming that one shouldn't care about things that don't directly effect him/her sounds really selfish.  I'm not used to talking to people like you. 
I don't quite understand why it's selfish to let people do what they want with their lives. I'm not saying "Don't judge me. It's my life." I'm saying that every one has the right to live their life like they want, I think it's selfish to take away their privileges because you don't agree.
Who's taking away privileges? That was done a long time ago when the law was made. All that's happening here is he's giving some advice, and while I think people should have every right to do things that can hurt themselves, I also think it's everybody's right (responsibility, even) to tell somebody when they're doing something stupid/harmful.
But, the thing is if you only tell one set of people that they're doing something stupid and wrong it's making them feel bad about something that they should feel bad about. As has been stated before, marijuana's not as harmful as many other things. Do you tell every one that smokes that they're doing something dumb that will cause them to die? Do you tell that to every one drinking alcohol? How 'bout every one that eats too much, and drinks too much coffee? If you only tell "pot heads" that, you're just telling them that it's worse than everything else.

Dave Chapell has a joke where he talks about smoking on a bus, and every one gets angry at him but not a homless man masturbating. This is just like that, they get angry at something sort of distructive, as opposed to something that's very distructive.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2007, 07:32:12 pm by Super_X »