Author Topic: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"  (Read 8461 times)

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Offline Warrior

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2008, 04:05:04 pm »
Both of those keep spending the same (Which is too high, and basically socialist.). I mean, really, what is he going to cut from to maintain national welfare, national health care, and some DNA testing thing that isn't going to work? Is he going to pull out of Iraq and use the same amount of money we've been spending over there? Oh yeah, that's such an economic drain we'll have the inflation rate of Nigeria in two years. Maybe we should just cut from education? But then as schools wouldn't exist anymore, Obama could fund public education for the poor, (and minorities). Maybe we could cut from military spending? Maybe we could sell all our military goods to China to help pay for the cost of something as ridiculous as national welfare/healthcare.

His plan is to either cut programs, or reform and reduce spending in those programs.
He will create many new jobs by opening up markets in renewable energy and deploying a next generation broadband infrastructure.

Improvement starts from the top and it trickles down, you will have the improvements and reforms to healthcare (Shift focus away from the socialist nature of his plan for a second and you'll see the reforms he has in store for both the pharmaceutical companies and for the transparency of the health sector itself)

The improvements should eventually reduce the amounts of chronic illnesses we now spend trillions treating because people lacked the health care to get it detected early on. Do you know how much it costs to treat cancer?

"Cancer is among the most significant contributors of health care spending in the United States, with the National Institutes of Health estimating its costs in 2002 at $171.6 billion, $60.9 billion of which was attributed to direct medical costs, $15.5 billion of which was attributed to indirect morbidity costs, and $95.2 of which was attributed to indirect mortality costs.1"

http://jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/content/full/22/17/3524

The same goes for his reform of NCLB and the education department as a whole, the improvements will show themselves in the form of higher graduation rates and a stronger working force as a result of it.

He's going to put an end to pork-barrel spending, close special interest loop holes, reform complicated tax codes, and stop the tax cuts for the wealthiest americans.

"President Bush's policies of giving tax breaks for the wealthy will cost the nation over $2.3 trillion by the time they expire in 2009"
Blueprint for Chance - pg32

But sure, pulling out of Iraq will undoubtedly open some fund pathways, but you're not looking at the bigger pictures. Various reforms to government agencies and policies will save us a shitload of money -- and in the long improvement in our nation across the board will be shown.

I really don't get what's not to like, what I see under his Presidency is instant tax cuts to the middle class to give us some needed relief from $4 a gallon gas, and long term investments in renewable energy to cut our carbon emission footprint in half by 2015.

What are the alternatives? Offshore drilling? Essentially giving Oil companies more land which they have not even used, to see a drop of oil from them in how long?

"The price of retail gasoline could fall by half, to around $2 a gallon, within 30 days of passage of a law to limit speculation in energy-futures markets, four energy analysts told Congress on Monday. "

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/gas-could-fall-2-if/story.aspx?guid={2673C102-68E0-41D9-9C9A-10EE2E723948}

To me, this seems like a much sounder economic plan as opposed to "Here's a 300 million dollar GRAND PRIZE to whoever can pull an energy efficient motor out of their ass the fastest"

Anyone who thinks healthcare reform won't bring reduced costs in the long term is out of their mind, do you know how many people go untreated because they can't afford it? That's not just a moral issue, but it leads to high rates of chronic illnesses and of course increase the numbers of morbid obesity.

How about the fact that a little under half of the seniors in my school did not graduate my senior year? NCLB has put us in corrective-action two yet nothing improves? So what exactly is this program paying for? Flashy exams? Such money could be better spent elsewhere.

I suggest you read Obama's Blueprint for Change, it may enlighten you some. 
« Last Edit: June 28, 2008, 03:38:58 am by Warrior »
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Offline Warrior

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2008, 04:05:56 pm »
It takes every "side" of an issue to come to the table willing to compromise and change for the better.  This is why I don't believe Barack Obama can really deliver on the "change" he promises.

Obama's State Senate Years Show Bipartisan Record

Quote
“People on both sides of the aisle would find him to be someone who would reach across to find out why people think the way they do,” said William Mahar, a former Republican state senator. “He wouldn’t talk just to people who agreed with him.”

You mean like this?

George W. Bush was one of the most middle of the road presidents to be elected ... new story once IN office though.

Cool I guess, but what does that have to do with Obama?
One must ask oneself: "do I will trolling to become a universal law?" And then when one realizes "yes, I do will it to be such," one feels completely justified.
-- from Groundwork for the Metaphysics of Trolling

Offline CrAz3D

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2008, 04:40:40 pm »
If a white guy lied a black guy is DEFINITELY gonna lie.





(I love my racist remarks)

Offline Warrior

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2008, 04:43:55 pm »
If a white guy lied a black guy is DEFINITELY gonna lie.





(I love my racist remarks)

oh yea totally
One must ask oneself: "do I will trolling to become a universal law?" And then when one realizes "yes, I do will it to be such," one feels completely justified.
-- from Groundwork for the Metaphysics of Trolling

Offline CrAz3D

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2008, 04:51:52 pm »
I'm glad you see it my way.

Offline while1

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2008, 09:54:32 pm »
If a white guy lied a black guy is DEFINITELY gonna lie.





(I love my racist remarks)
Huh... ok.  Race has nothing to do with it.

We'll see.  Likely I won't vote for Obama and now I'm not even sure I'd vote for McCain as he's increasingly making promises he can't keep.  I will support Obama if he is elected and give him my due respect... we'll see how well he lives up to his promises.  Being a cynic and generally distrustful of all politicians, I am just not convinced he isn't the "same old" Washington he refers to.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2008, 10:05:52 pm by while1 »
I tend to edit my topics and replies frequently.

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Offline leet_muffin

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #21 on: June 28, 2008, 03:18:59 am »
Both of those keep spending the same (Which is too high, and basically socialist.). I mean, really, what is he going to cut from to maintain national welfare, national health care, and some DNA testing thing that isn't going to work? Is he going to pull out of Iraq and use the same amount of money we've been spending over there? Oh yeah, that's such an economic drain we'll have the inflation rate of Nigeria in two years. Maybe we should just cut from education? But then as schools wouldn't exist anymore, Obama could fund public education for the poor, (and minorities). Maybe we could cut from military spending? Maybe we could sell all our military goods to China to help pay for the cost of something as ridiculous as national welfare/healthcare.

lol

I don't think you get it. Even if it is designed to help the people, I don't like socialism. In fact, I hardly like government, and therefore like a smaller government. I feel like I have the ability to make a living on my own and live an enjoyable life without any authoritarian figure helping me, or hindering me.

Warrior, what is your ideal form of government?
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Offline Rule

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #22 on: June 28, 2008, 03:26:54 am »
I don't think you get it. Even if it is designed to help the people, I don't like socialism. In fact, I hardly like government, and therefore like a smaller government. I feel like I have the ability to make a living on my own and live an enjoyable life without any authoritarian figure helping me, or hindering me.

That's a very simplistic attitude.  How far would you take it?  If the government withdrew all of its regulations and subsidies, I'm sure you'd be extremely unhappy.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2008, 03:37:22 am by Rule »

Offline Warrior

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Re: "Black folk got a chip on their shoulder"
« Reply #23 on: June 28, 2008, 03:48:14 am »
Both of those keep spending the same (Which is too high, and basically socialist.). I mean, really, what is he going to cut from to maintain national welfare, national health care, and some DNA testing thing that isn't going to work? Is he going to pull out of Iraq and use the same amount of money we've been spending over there? Oh yeah, that's such an economic drain we'll have the inflation rate of Nigeria in two years. Maybe we should just cut from education? But then as schools wouldn't exist anymore, Obama could fund public education for the poor, (and minorities). Maybe we could cut from military spending? Maybe we could sell all our military goods to China to help pay for the cost of something as ridiculous as national welfare/healthcare.

lol

I don't think you get it. Even if it is designed to help the people, I don't like socialism. In fact, I hardly like government, and therefore like a smaller government. I feel like I have the ability to make a living on my own and live an enjoyable life without any authoritarian figure helping me, or hindering me.

Warrior, what is your ideal form of government?

Well, what economic class would you consider yourself? I don't think you can deny that the middle class is facing hardships and needs relief as soon as possible. I think that it is the responsibility of the government to help out it's citizens in times of economic crisis.

Along the way, I think that the reforms will help in a long run. I don't see this too much as enlarging government, it's more like reforming existing policies. The most radical change would be health care, while I don't myself agree that such a radical change is needed -- it's definitely loads better than what we have now.

To answer your question, my ideal form of government is one that protects it's citizens. Not just in terms of keeping them safe from aggression from foreign nations, but keeps them safe from economic despair as well. I don't see things as black and white such as capitalism vs socialism or liberal vs conservative -- I believe the approach to take needs to be examined from the context of the situation.

Like I mentioned before though, I may not agree with everything he has to say -- but I also don't vote on the basis of one issue.
One must ask oneself: "do I will trolling to become a universal law?" And then when one realizes "yes, I do will it to be such," one feels completely justified.
-- from Groundwork for the Metaphysics of Trolling