Do you believe in God, or Evolution?

[CrAz3D]

Both.

God -> universe -> us

Intelligent Design for me

[rabbit]

Sty, you're forgetting religion is a bit wacky sometimes.  There are a lot of people who believe the world was created not so long ago, and a lot of them believe (IIRC) that God made everything appear as it is.  To them, scientific evidence means diddly-squat.

[Sidoh]

I'm unsure about evolution (I may have read something somewhere about the church declaring at least "recognition" of Darwin's theory, but I could be entirely wrong), but things like Galileo, for instance. In the past, scientific ideas like that were looked down on. But in today's modern world, science is taught in school, and children are brought up to both accept science, and if their family is religious, and religion, not choose one or the other. We often take for granted that our society lets us study science and accept it as well as accept a faith. In the past, this wasn't possible. Everything was explained through myths and "God only knows". We're very lucky we live in an age that grasps both.

The church doing anything other than acknowledging anything evolution would be nothing short of mind numbing.  It's rare that churches adopt heresy or do much more than teach against them. I agree that science is much more integrated in education curriculum (that's extremely obvious), but that doesn't mean that science and religion are inseparable.

If you seperate them, than you have to choose between two ways the Universe was formed. Both have their bright points, both have their downfalls. The unfortunate thing is, we can't surely know which is correct, and it leads to a lot of confusion, which may be holding us back. Is it wise, then to seperate two entirely good theories? You could think of it as how Einstein wished for the Unification of Gravity and Electromagnitism. While the matters are entirely different, finding a way to join the two together might prove both a way to simplify things, and might actually be a way for us to learn even more.

Until science finds a way to prove the existance of God, it's little more than a false hope that the two will ever be inseparably united.  Most religions clash with science.  Conversely, most scientific theories contradict most religions.

This is completely idealistic, though. There's really no proof that says allowing the two major philosophies of Creation to be joined will actually do much of anything but cause disruption. It's just an idea, though, and I personally have never believed in one or the other. I see both as good ways to explain our birth, and accept both of them in the same amount. I leave the rest up to speculation until there's more evidence.

That's kind of like concurrently believing that the sun rises both in the east and the west.  At least in Christianity (and other similar religions), it completely rejects any idea that science has proposed in order to replace faith in an omniscient being.

Both.

God -> universe -> us

Intelligent Design for me

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Rule: good points.

[d&q]

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Well, I tried to get the Christian god, but since it was brand name, I had to settle for the cheaper generic from Wal Mart.

[CrAz3D]

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Well, I tried to get the Christian god, but since it was brand name, I had to settle for the cheaper generic from Wal Mart.

8)

I'm technically not sure.  I don't know what the Christian god is.  Also, doesn't that change for different Christian denominations?

I believe He is all powerful, knowing, and good (PKG).  I believe that He created the universe.  I believe that He created us in His likeness (not physical image though). 
I don't believe He created us and everything else directly.

[Joe]

@Christian god -- He knows everything, hears everything, sees everything, is everywhere, has good intent for all things, and is slow to anger, but assuming you make him mad he WILL kill you (or worse), no questions asked.

@Science: "In the beginning there was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. It was with Him in the beginning. Through Him all things were made. Without Him nothing was made that has been made." That being said, in my opinion, science is the study of stuff that was made by God, wether or not the scientists know what they're studying or not. Recently science learned to create matter and antimatter by accelerating and colliding particles. They claimed to have created their own mini-universe and were essencially god over their creation. Wrong! They discovered what God laid down in the very beginning when he created the earth and the physical laws that govern it, and then put them into action using the power God gave us over the earth. Genesis 1:28 says that God gave us the power to rule the world, and he never specified that we couldn't create things of our own though particle collision.

@Topic -- As if it isn't dreadfully clear yet, I believe in the Christian Gods Jehovah, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost. I believe they all existed from before the world began, and are still alive to this day, with the exception of Jesus dying and going to hell for two days and three nights to redeem us from our sins. I believe that everything in the bible is true, and that's the foundation of every sermon my pastors preach on Sundays and Wednesdays.

[Joe]

While it's said that he created the world in seven days, were they our days, or were they "God" days, which can be timeless? If that's the case, then evolution may be a way to explain how God created the earth.

That came up in a disucssion in church one Wednesday. I brought that up in a conversation with Sidoh and he put a good point. If God created the bible for us, and is benevolent, why would he use anything other than one full rotation of the earth, knowing that it would do nothing but confuse us.

[Warrior]

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Well, I tried to get the Christian god, but since it was brand name, I had to settle for the cheaper generic from Wal Mart.

LOL YOU GOT ALLAH!!

[ZeroX]

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83799#msg83799 date=1153619423]

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Well, I tried to get the Christian god, but since it was brand name, I had to settle for the cheaper generic from Wal Mart.

LOL YOU GOT ALLAH!!

[Joe]

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83799#msg83799 date=1153619423]

Do you believe in the Christian god, or some generic god that shares similar properties?

Well, I tried to get the Christian god, but since it was brand name, I had to settle for the cheaper generic from Wal Mart.

LOL YOU GOT ALLAH!!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Sidoh]

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83797#msg83797 date=1153619252]
@Christian god -- He knows everything, hears everything, sees everything, is everywhere, has good intent for all things, and is slow to anger, but assuming you make him mad he WILL kill you (or worse), no questions asked.

Benevolent, omniscient beings don't get "mad."

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83797#msg83797 date=1153619252]
@Science: "In the beginning there was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. It was with Him in the beginning. Through Him all things were made. Without Him nothing was made that has been made." That being said, in my opinion, science is the study of stuff that was made by God, wether or not the scientists know what they're studying or not. Recently science learned to create matter and antimatter by accelerating and colliding particles. They claimed to have created their own mini-universe and were essencially god over their creation. Wrong! They discovered what God laid down in the very beginning when he created the earth and the physical laws that govern it, and then put them into action using the power God gave us over the earth. Genesis 1:28 says that God gave us the power to rule the world, and he never specified that we couldn't create things of our own though particle collision.

Don't try to use scripture as logic.  It doesn't work.

Investing insurmountable amounts of energy into a single particle will do things like that.  It makes perfect sense.  I have no idea where you read that scientists thought they were governing some sort of universe, but I highly suspect that that portion of your statement was either adlib, false or fudged.  Under the correct conditions, "conjuring" matter is as simple as investing large amounts of energy into the system, just as annihlating matter produces large amounts of energy (matter anti-matter 'explosions.').

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83797#msg83797 date=1153619252]
@Topic -- As if it isn't dreadfully clear yet, I believe in the Christian Gods Jehovah, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost. I believe they all existed from before the world began, and are still alive to this day, with the exception of Jesus dying and going to hell for two days and three nights to redeem us from our sins. I believe that everything in the bible is true, and that's the foundation of every sermon my pastors preach on Sundays and Wednesdays.

I think that it's completely obvious that any sort of omnipotent god is present in every point in time, and consequentially, every point in space.

It is intuitively obvious that no omniscient being can transfer the entirety of his consciousness onto something as fragile and finite as a human body and mind.  The physical appearance of Jesus was a manifestation of a deity.  He didn't "die" in any sort of sense that we will die.

Honestly, Joe, I think you're pulling stuff out of your ass.  It makes you look like a retard.

[leet_muffin]

x86] link=topic=6743.msg83797#msg83797 date=1153619252]
@Topic -- As if it isn't dreadfully clear yet, I believe in the Christian Gods Jehovah, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost. I believe they all existed from before the world began, and are still alive to this day, with the exception of Jesus dying and going to hell for two days and three nights to redeem us from our sins. I believe that everything in the bible is true, and that's the foundation of every sermon my pastors preach on Sundays and Wednesdays.

Was the thought that the universe revolved around Earth taken directly from the Bible? Or did Christians just manage to get that from God? What about sphearical vs. flat earth? Or germs? Evolution?

If they got all that from the Bible, you're a fool for believing everything it says. If they just 'got it from God', That's another example of failure @ organized religion.

[Sidoh]

Was the thought that the universe revolved around Earth taken directly from the Bible? Or did Christians just manage to get that from God? What about sphearical vs. flat earth? Or germs? Evolution?

If they got all that from the Bible, you're a fool for believing everything it says. If they just 'got it from God', That's another example of failure @ organized religion.

That being said, in my opinion, science is the study of stuff that was made by God, wether or not the scientists know what they're studying or not. Recently science learned to create matter and antimatter by accelerating and colliding particles.

Clearly whatever you believe disallows you to read. ¬_¬

[leet_muffin]

Was the thought that the universe revolved around Earth taken directly from the Bible? Or did Christians just manage to get that from God? What about sphearical vs. flat earth? Or germs? Evolution?

If they got all that from the Bible, you're a fool for believing everything it says. If they just 'got it from God', That's another example of failure @ organized religion.

That being said, in my opinion, science is the study of stuff that was made by God, wether or not the scientists know what they're studying or not. Recently science learned to create matter and antimatter by accelerating and colliding particles.

Clearly whatever you believe disallows you to read. ¬_¬

How does that answer any of my questions?

[Sidoh]

How does that answer any of my questions?

It actually answers all of your questions, if you were paying attention.  Since you're clearly unable to understand the implications of his statements, I suppose I'll make them more explicit for you.

As Joe said, it can validly be said that science is the study of what God has created in the Universe.  He did not make Biology, Physics or Chemistry books and hand them to us.  He did not have the bible created in the image as a "The Universe for Dummies" book.  He gave us the minds to discover part of what the Universe is construed of, which is what we have been doing since science (and philosophy).

Joe isn't saying science hasn't successfully answered many questions we have had about our Universe, he's saying that it is a separate entity which has been granted to us to understand the Universe.

You're right.  There's nothing in the Bible about the Earth being round, but God certainly gave people the minds to determine that this is the correct model of our planet.