What are some good anti-abortion/abortion points?

[CrAz3D]

..We are x86 forums.

ooops, I just copied/pasted from my vL post, forgot to change that

[Super_X]

Against: hitler was born
For: the fact that hitlers mom was talked out of having an abortion

That doesn't make sense to me. :\

Against - The long-term psychological effects are often negative for the mother; they will often feel guilt for the destruction of a potential life.

Ok let me re phrase that: hitler's mom opted out of having an abortion because her doctor talked her out of it.
Just a simple statement really.

Do you have any credible evidence that this was so? I don't know how far abortion technology advanced to that era, and it smells like bullshit anyway. How can you blame a mother for bringing a charismatic, ambitious, and potentially murderous child into the world? You're disgusting.

For abortion: Rape, underage sex, that junk. ( I think there should be a way that if you get an abortion like, twice you get your ovaries cut out.) I'm just for killing babies. Or, going the Modest Proposal way, and keeping them alive, then eating them. Also, there's that whole over population thing.

Against abortion: Lots or people like Veil, maybe they'll like baby people, too!

[GameSnake]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

[CrAz3D]

Newby(I think) made that point here, or at vL already.

[igimo1]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

So you're telling me infanticide is ok, right?

[Sidoh]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

Yes.  That's where the argument of an metaphysical existance (a soul) comes into play.

[Newby]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

So you're telling me infanticide is ok, right?

Yes I am. Have a problem? Did I offend you?

[igimo1]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

So you're telling me infanticide is ok, right?

Yes I am. Have a problem? Did I offend you?

Learn your manners, scum. I wasn't talking to you.

[GameSnake]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

Yes.  That's where the argument of an metaphysical existance (a soul) comes into play.

A soul is still just an argument, not a proven fact, so that doesnt really do it for me.

[Quik]

Also, Quik, I didn't say I was against women's rights, I said I was against "women's right to choose", HUGE difference.

Trying to get you to be VERY careful how you phrase things when arguing successfully on some subjects, where people may be more vocal.

[Sidoh]

Sorry Crazed, I don't like running debates like that.  I'm going to counter points as I see them.  If it's too irritating, we can split the posts.  Aside from that, Gamesnake's point is rather invalid to begin with.

A soul is still just an argument, not a proven fact, so that doesnt really do it for me.

Nonetheless, the argument exists (and there is logical proof for its existence).  It is definitely strong enough to effectively counter your argument, especially when you claim that it is unquestionably true as you have.  Aside from that point, you're destroying a potential life; that is unarguable.  Just because the thing you're killing is incapable of storing memories of pre-sequential events does not mean that it will be able to.  The potential for memory is a physical change in the infant's neural tissue.  Memory is a physical phenomena, so why can't mere existence vindicate the right to live?  I'm sure you'll agree with me that the embryo is definitely a bundle of baryonic matter.

[MyndFyre]

For abortion: Rape, underage sex, that junk.

I don't think a secular society can legitimately ban rape pregnancy abortions.  Having said so, I think it's still not positive.

Underage sex: if kids are young enough to understand how it works, they understand what happens.  Parents who don't control that should be responsible for any outcomes.

[Newby]

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

So you're telling me infanticide is ok, right?

Yes I am. Have a problem? Did I offend you?

Scum? Watch it.

Learn your manners, scum. I wasn't talking to you.

[CrAz3D]

Sorry Crazed, I don't like running debates like that.  I'm going to counter points as I see them.  If it's too irritating, we can split the posts.  Aside from that, Gamesnake's point is rather invalid to begin with.

Yeah, I've given up now.

Debate ON

If the person has no knowledge of ever being alive, does it really matter?

I say we kill ever retarded person then.  They don't have a clue as to what is going on, they're just a massive burden on society.
Some old people could go too,.

[MyndFyre]

I say we kill ever retarded person then.  They don't have a clue as to what is going on, they're just a massive burden on society.

This is a good point.  We don't hold qualms about intelligent life, it's human life that we believe has innate value.