"You know, if I was a girl I would date him."

[GameSnake]

"By the time he got to Oklahoma State University, Walker was dating guys. But now, at age 34, he has been out of homosexuality for more than seven years."

CRead article

Being gay = a choice apparantly.

[Sidoh]

Being gay = a choice apparantly.

If you disagree, you're stupid.

[ZeroX]

I know........

Which dumbass came up with Homosexualy is a genetic disorder?

[Sidoh]

I know........

Which dumbass came up with Homosexualy is a genetic disorder?

Hormone imbalances can contribute to a higher risk of becoming homosexual, but becoming homosexual is definitely a choice.

[rabbit]

Prove it.

[deadly7]

I'm pretty sure the word "homosexual" means to have sex with a person of the same gender or something, which would be a choice.

[Newby]

Could you see yourself choosing to have sex with men? Could you see yourself suddenly not liking women afterwards?

I'm sorry. I don't see myself kissing any guys soon. I'm straight and I don't think I could choose to like guys.

[Sidoh]

Prove it.

of, relating to, or involving sexual intercourse between persons of the same sex

You don't think consentual sex with a person of the same gender is a choice?

[iago]

Ok, I said this before and I'll say it again:

A guy fucking another guy is a choice.  Obviousy. 

A guy getting a boner by looking at another guy isn't. 

Like Newby said, can you see yourself choosing to love guys and not girls?  If you can't, then how can anybody?

[MyndFyre]

Could you see yourself choosing to have sex with men? Could you see yourself suddenly not liking women afterwards?

I'm sorry. I don't see myself kissing any guys soon. I'm straight and I don't think I could choose to like guys.

No, but I'll bet you get a boner when you're watching a guy get a bj from a chick.  Doesn't matter what parts of the chick are visible.  That's my theory, about you anyway. 

[Newby]

No, but I'll bet you get a boner when you're watching a guy get a bj from a chick.  Doesn't matter what parts of the chick are visible.  That's my theory, about you anyway. 

So? That's straight.

[GameSnake]

A gay man is gay, but he can "cured", being gay is a desiese?

[iago]

A gay man is gay, but he can "cured", being gay is a desiese?

I doubt it.  But often, a gay person will date girls because he doesn't understand or can't admit that he's gay.  I think it's fully possible that that can work the other way, too.  If he's straight now, then I'm pretty confident that he's always been straight. 

[GameSnake]

"..estimates it has successfully treated tens of thousands of people since it began three decades ago in San Francisco."

These christian based groups are calling homosexuality a treatable thing.

[rabbit]

So Christians are correct whenever they say anything?

[GameSnake]

So Christians are correct whenever they say anything?

I'm quoting thr article.

[Rule]

Homosexuals choose to like men in the same way heterosexuals choose to like women.  In other words, a majority of homosexuals are naturally (genetically) predisposed to be attracted to men.  Why do you think so many homosexuals
feel guilty and try to hide their preference at a young age?  Because they enjoy their sexual preference?

Anyone who disagrees is an idiot. 

[Sidoh]

Ok, I said this before and I'll say it again:

A guy fucking another guy is a choice.  Obviousy. 

A guy getting a boner by looking at another guy isn't. 

Like Newby said, can you see yourself choosing to love guys and not girls?  If you can't, then how can anybody?

You become homosexual by having consensual intercourse with a person of the same sex.  You stay homosexual by enjoying it and continuing it.

Homosexuals choose to like men in the same way heterosexuals choose to like women.  In other words, a majority of homosexuals are naturally (genetically) predisposed to be attracted to men.  Why do you think so many homosexuals
feel guilty and try to hide their preference at a young age?  Because they enjoy their sexual preference?

Anyone who disagrees is an idiot. 

Hormone imbalances can contribute to a higher risk of becoming homosexual, but becoming homosexual is definitely a choice.

Homosexuality is a choice.  Enjoying homosexuality is not.

Just because a baby was exposed to cocaine as an infant (and is effectively made susceptible to becoming addicted to the drug), does that make doing the drug this person's fate?  No.  It's a choice.

[CrAz3D]

this again?........what happened to the last thread like this, did it just end or did someone "win"?

[Sidoh]

this again?........what happened to the last thread like this, did it just end or did someone "win"?

This thread is about homosexuality.  Who really cares?  I don't see anything wrong with a reasonable debate.  If you don't want to add anything useful, I suggest you mark it as read and move on.

[CrAz3D]

this again?........what happened to the last thread like this, did it just end or did someone "win"?

This thread is about homosexuality.  Who really cares?  I don't see anything wrong with a reasonable debate.  If you don't want to add anything useful, I suggest you mark it as read and move on.

I was just wondering if a conclusion came in the last thread, since it was discussed recently.




Anyhow, how many people have had bad experiences with the opposite sex before turning homosexual?  The few people I've heard of that have turned had a few bad experiences before & they decided to try out the other sex.

[Sidoh]

I was just wondering if a conclusion came in the last thread, since it was discussed recently.

Maybe.  I don't remember.

Anyhow, how many people have had bad experiences with the opposite sex before turning homosexual?  The few people I've heard of that have turned had a few bad experiences before & they decided to try out the other sex.

I'm not sure, but I would deduce that the majority of homosexual individuals choose to be so because of a genetic predisposition, not because it's another option they'd like to give a chance.  Persons of the same sex simply seem more appealing to them.

[CrAz3D]

but I would deduce that the majority of homosexual individuals choose to be so because of a genetic predisposition

Out of curiosity, how would you feel about classifying homosexuality as a mild mental disorder?

[Sidoh]

Out of curiosity, how would you feel about classifying homosexuality as a mild mental disorder?

No.  That's one of the silliest things that people can argue when discussing homosexuality, I think.

I think it could be considered a genetic disorder in the way that some homosexuals do have a hormone imbalance (less testosterone), which definitely contributes to abnormal choice in sexual preferance.  Hormones effect the mind, not visa-versa.

[CrAz3D]

aw, yeah, I meant genetic (since you believe it is due to genetics) disorder, my apologies.
Like something that can/should be fixed, would that work?

[Sidoh]

aw, yeah, I meant genetic (since you believe it is due to genetics) disorder, my apologies.
Like something that can/should be fixed, would that work?

I think most homosexuals are content with the way they are.  Forcing them to take hormone supliments would be crude, inhumane and useless.

Don't get me wrong, I disagree with homosexuality, but I don't think we should interfere with the way God has made them unless they give their sincere consent.

[CrAz3D]

What about little kids with ADD? 
I have a friend that said he doesnt like his medicine, he feels alot happier & better without it, I dont think he consents to taking the medicine

[Sidoh]

What about little kids with ADD? 
I have a friend that said he doesnt like his medicine, he feels alot happier & better without it, I dont think he consents to taking the medicine

That's for his own good, though.  Despite the fact he looses his happiness while on the medication, I also suspect it has great effects on his focus in school.  If I remember correctly, ADD subsides (or at least becomes much more dormant) in adulthood?  If he's unable to learn and recieve decent scores, he's much less likely to succeed in life.

[Rule]

Homosexuality is a choice.  Enjoying homosexuality is not.

We're thinking the same thing I think, so we should try and be clear about definitions in this argument to avoid any confusion.

Homosexual
Of, relating to, or having a sexual orientation to persons of the same sex.

sexual orientation
The direction of one's sexual interest toward members of the same, opposite, or both sexes.

To me "homosexual" means sexually interested in the same sex, and "heterosexual" means sexually interested in the opposite sex.  Whether someone acts on their interest or not is different, and doesn't have a special classification.

I think 12 year olds can be homosexual without having acted on their urges.



re: crazed.  You seem to generally be really uncomfortable with things that are different (referring a little to the xenophobic argument, "liberal ideas", etc.)  Almost everything about a person is a result of genetics --
their hair colour, their eye colour, their skin colour, their height, their raw intellect, ..., their sexual preference.  Just because something is different doesn't mean we should think of it as "wrong" or "bad." 

As long as someone is not harming people, he should not be "cured" or changed to be like other people unless he wants to be.  And based on what I've heard from a lot of homosexuals, they would love to become heterosexual.  Being homosexual makes your life a lot more difficult.

[Sidoh]

We're thinking the same thing I think, so we should try and be clear about definitions in this argument to avoid any confusion.

Homosexual
Of, relating to, or having a sexual orientation to persons of the same sex.

sexual orientation
The direction of one's sexual interest toward members of the same, opposite, or both sexes.

2 : of, relating to, or involving sexual intercourse between persons of the same sex

To me "homosexual" means sexually interested in the same sex, and "heterosexual" means sexually interested in the opposite sex.  Whether someone acts on their interest or not is different, and doesn't have a special classification.

According to your same source, it also follows my definition.

I think 12 year olds can be homosexual without having acted on their urges.

Sexual drive is rarely present in prepubescent individuals.

re: crazed.  You seem to generally be really uncomfortable with things that are different (referring a little to the xenophobic argument, "liberal ideas", etc.)  Almost everything about a person is a result of genetics --
their hair colour, their eye colour, their skin colour, their height, their raw intellect, ..., their sexual preference.  Just because something is different doesn't mean we should think of it as "wrong" or "bad." 

I don't see anywhere that he said that.  In fact, I think he was baiting me into saying the exact same thing you're suggesting he's guilty of.  Religion plays a massive role in this argument.  Christianity explicitly states that homosexuality is against the will of God.  Because of this, Christians will deem it as wrong and bad.

As long as someone is not harming people, he should not be "cured" or changed to be like other people unless he wants to be.  And based on what I've heard from a lot of homosexuals, they would love to become heterosexual.  Being homosexual makes your life a lot more difficult.

Why'd you say "he?"  Women can be homosexual too.  SEXIST!

That's what I've already said.  Do you not read my posts? -_-

I think most homosexuals are content with the way they are.  Forcing them to take hormone supliments would be crude, inhumane and useless.

Don't get me wrong, I disagree with homosexuality, but I don't think we should interfere with the way God has made them unless they give their sincere consent.

[Rule]

Since there are conflicting definitions, we should remove the ambiguity by coming up with our own.  I suggest we let "heterosexual" mean interested in the opposite sex, and "heterosexual++" refer to sexual intercourse.

At a very young age I think we develop feelings towards the opposite sex.  I know that I liked girls before I hit puberty.

The crazed comment was referring to threads on the Valhalla Legends forum.

[Sidoh]

Since there are conflicting definitions, we should remove the ambiguity by coming up with our own.  I suggest we let "heterosexual" mean interested in the opposite sex, and "heterosexual++" refer to sexual intercourse.

Hm... then comes another problem: what do we call virgins? >_>

ASEXUALS!

At a very young age I think we develop feelings towards the opposite sex.  I know that I liked girls before I hit puberty.

Yeah, but did you want to pound them?  Even the definition that disagrees with the one I tend to use says homosexuality and heterosexuality deals with sexual tendancies,.

The crazed comment was referring to threads on the Valhalla Legends forum.

I don't visit the vL forums.

[iago]

Since there are conflicting definitions, we should remove the ambiguity by coming up with our own.  I suggest we let "heterosexual" mean interested in the opposite sex, and "heterosexual++" refer to sexual intercourse.

Hm... then comes another problem: what do we call virgins? >_>

ASEXUALS!

You're still obviously taking the wrong meaning.  A virgin is still a heterosexual or a homosexual, depending on what turns him on.  I suppose if nothing turned him on that would make him an asexual, but that's not what you said. 

The problem here IS a failure to communicate.  I subscribe to Rule's definition.  Homosexuality is not about having sex with another man, there are lots of homosexuals who have never done so.  Homosexuality is about being attracted to other men.  If you just want to talk about having sex, then obviously it's a choice, but you don't choose to be attracted.  Whether it's genetic predisposition or the environment they grew up in doesn't really matter, it still isn't a choice. 

That's what I was trying to explain in that fairy tale thread.  It's not about two princes fucking each other, it's about them falling in love.  There's a HUGE difference when discussing what is appropriate for children. 

[Sidoh]

You're still obviously taking the wrong meaning.  A virgin is still a heterosexual or a homosexual, depending on what turns him on.  I suppose if nothing turned him on that would make him an asexual, but that's not what you said. 

What makes my definition wrong?  It's also in the dictionary.

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/homosexual see for yourself.

The problem here IS a failure to communicate.  I subscribe to Rule's definition.  Homosexuality is not about having sex with another man, there are lots of homosexuals who have never done so.  Homosexuality is about being attracted to other men.  If you just want to talk about having sex, then obviously it's a choice, but you don't choose to be attracted.  Whether it's genetic predisposition or the environment they grew up in doesn't really matter, it still isn't a choice. 

Of course that isn't a choice, that's blatantly obvious.  However, my definition is in the dictionary too.  I fail to see any wrong in using it.

[ZeroX]

At a very young age I think we develop feelings towards the opposite sex.  I know that I liked girls before I hit puberty.

Some people at a very young age Mature faster then others. There is nothing wrong with that just that your Hormone were kicking in at a very young age.

[iago]

You're still obviously taking the wrong meaning.  A virgin is still a heterosexual or a homosexual, depending on what turns him on.  I suppose if nothing turned him on that would make him an asexual, but that's not what you said. 

What makes my definition wrong?  It's also in the dictionary.

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/homosexual see for yourself.

I didn't say your definition is wrong, I said you're using the wrong definition.  I don't care if a guy screws a guy or a girl.  It doesn't make a big difference in the end.  What matters is how the person feels in the long run. 

[Sidoh]

I didn't say your definition is wrong, I said you're using the wrong definition. 

They're both in the dictionary.  Why's one more correct than the other?

I don't care if a guy screws a guy or a girl.  It doesn't make a big difference in the end.  What matters is how the person feels in the long run. 

It doesn't matter if you care or not; they're both in the dictionary.  What you think isn't going to change that.

Since sexual intercourse is the epitome of all intimate feelings, I think it plays an incontestably important role in this subject.

[Rule]

Since sexual intercourse is the epitome of all intimate feelings, I think it plays an incontestably important role in this subject.

I don't.  I'm not sexually attracted to men. If I made the choice to have sex with a man (for whatever reason), I wouldn't enjoy it, and I don't think I'd be considered gay by the commonly accepted definition of "homosexual."

All that matters is whether you're attracted towards the same or opposite sex.  Whether you act on it doesn't say anything about your sexual orientation or not.  Most homosexuals don't WANT to be attracted to men; they are homosexual because they are attracted to men.  This is the commonly accepted definition.  Ask any of your real life friends if you'd be considered "homosexual" if you were (strongly) sexually attracted to men, and see what they say.

To answer your earlier question, yes I was sexually interested in girls before I hit puberty.  I couldn't impregnate them, but I was interested in having sexual relations with them (which encompasses: kissing, etc), and I think most of my friends were too.

[Sidoh]

Despite your best efforts, none of your logic demystifies the fact that the definition I prefer to use is in the dictionary.

[Rule]

Despite your best efforts, none of your logic demystifies the fact that the definition I prefer to use is in the dictionary.

Homosexual, adjective
1 : of, relating to, or characterized by a tendency to direct sexual desire toward another of the same sex         
2 : of, relating to, or involving sexual intercourse between persons of the same sex

1 is still the common definition.  Definition 2 is associated with the action of having a particular type of sex (e.g. he is having homosexual sex).  Definition 1 is used to describe people with a certain sexual preference.

[Sidoh]

Haha, yeah.  I've realized I'm wrong for a while, but I like structured argument, as I'm sure most people on those boards will tell you.

I had another point, but I think it's wrong too, haha.  I'm too tired to post it at the moment anyway. ;p