LG Voyager

[CrAz3D]

http://www.letsgomobile.org/en/2434/lg-voyager/
Thoughts?  Looks like the env 2.0/iPhone attempt.

I think I might get that come april when my contract is up for renewal

[Camel]

Wait until there are consumer reviews. Wouldn't want to buy it only to find out that it breaks after a week.

Also, I find it hard to believe it will be as good as the original. The full keypad is nice, but I find that people who refuse to adapt are just stubborn and stuck in their ways anyways.

Since this is a CDMA phone, I might give it some thought if my phone ever breaks.

[CrAz3D]

Wait until there are consumer reviews. Wouldn't want to buy it only to find out that it breaks after a week.

Also, I find it hard to believe it will be as good as the original. The full keypad is nice, but I find that people who refuse to adapt are just stubborn and stuck in their ways anyways.

Since this is a CDMA phone, I might give it some thought if my phone ever breaks.

Yeah, I won't be getting anything til April (this is supposed to launch in late Nov.) so I'll definitely read up and wait, UNLIKE I did with the POS Chocolate.

See, the full keypad might be nice, I'm not sure yet.  I know I hate the way that the env feels, now.  This looks a lot better.

[trust]

this looks nice

[CrAz3D]

You have the env, yeah?  You like?  I've had a few people suggest it to me (here, other forums, and friends) when I had issues with my chocolate

[Skywing]

I would wait for one of the EVDO Rev.A capable PDA handsets that are (theoretically) supposed to be announced November-ish.  Then again, you may well have very different requirements for what you're looking for in a device than me.

EVDO Rev.A is significantly better than Rev.0 in terms of latency and the quality of the reverse link if you are planning on tethering your phone at all, or in the case of a PDA, using latency-sensitive programs (ssh/RDP and soforth).  Compared to Rev.0 (with which I typically saw 150-200ms to the tower), I usually see 50-60ms to the tower with Rev.A.  (Routing beyond that does add nontrivially to latency above that, but a 90-140ms or so improvement in latency is still significant.  I typically get 150-200ms real work latency to most sites in the US with Rev.A after adding in routing paths.)

The PDA phones are typically much friendlier to running user-developed software without having to try and hack around DRM protections that most of the consumer grade phones are crippled with.

Personally, I am looking at the xv6800, though Verizon has yet to officially announce it.

[CrAz3D]

That huh?  Could've sworn I've seen that on their website before...scratch that, I guess I'm thinking 6700.

I don't know that I'd notice issues as those that you mentioned.  Basically I'd be using it as a phone and organizer for the most point.

[trust]

You have the env, yeah?  You like?  I've had a few people suggest it to me (here, other forums, and friends) when I had issues with my chocolate

yes I like it. It's a bit clunky but it isn't really an issue.

[CrAz3D]

hmm, k.
You ever use email/web browsing on it?  If so, ought I look at things Skywing mentioned or have you experience much lag?

[Camel]

I would wait for one of the EVDO Rev.A capable PDA handsets that are (theoretically) supposed to be announced November-ish.  Then again, you may well have very different requirements for what you're looking for in a device than me.

November? That's pretty quick, since we just pushed Rev.A out the door in January. It took much longer for Rev.0 to catch on.

You'll notice improved QoS in Rev.A because Rev.0 didn't have QoS. :)

You forgot to mention that Rev.A has the added benefit of megabit uplink speeds, I believe. I might be mistaking that for 5.0, though.

We just created the 7.0 database at work on Friday o.O

[Skywing]

From a BTS perspective, my understanding is that the transition from Rev.0 to Rev.A is primarily just swapping out a transceiver card at the site.  I would imagine most of the delay between Verizon's Rev.0 and Rev.A general purpose rollouts was due to QA and observing the behavior of smaller scale test rollouts before a full production deployment network-wide.

I don't typically see >1mbit reverse link speeds in practice (though >1mbit is within spec in ideal circumstances); it is more common that I observe 60-80KBps in locations with a solid link to the tower, much less at fringe areas.  It is certainly much improved over the 144kbit/sec max reverse link in Rev.0, though.

[CrAz3D]

Being that I am completely ignorant in this area, in layman's terms what benefits will Rev.A offer?
Does this involved all phone or more specifically PDA phones?

[trust]

hmm, k.
You ever use email/web browsing on it?  If so, ought I look at things Skywing mentioned or have you experience much lag?

no I havent

[Camel]

From a BTS perspective, my understanding is that the transition from Rev.0 to Rev.A is primarily just swapping out a transceiver card at the site.  I would imagine most of the delay between Verizon's Rev.0 and Rev.A general purpose rollouts was due to QA and observing the behavior of smaller scale test rollouts before a full production deployment network-wide.

From my perspective, that seems pretty generalized, but not inaccurate. It does ultimately boil down to replacing DOM cards with DOM-A cards to turn the tower in to a Rev.A accessible tower. There's lots of infrastructure and software changes that need to take place first, though. I'm not at liberty to discuss the changes, and even if I was, I only understand a fraction of what they are.

I don't typically see >1mbit reverse link speeds in practice (though >1mbit is within spec in ideal circumstances); it is more common that I observe 60-80KBps in locations with a solid link to the tower, much less at fringe areas.  It is certainly much improved over the 144kbit/sec max reverse link in Rev.0, though.

I clarified the Rev.A/5.0 thing; Rev.A is just QoS, 5.0 will introduce broadband on the reverse link. I can't talk about specifics, but 5.0 should be going out soon. Let's just say we're at the "get in the van and see how far away it works" stage. :)

Even if you have a Rev.A handset, you're not guaranteed to be talking to a DOM-A on the other end of the tower. They're becoming more widespread, but it's a slow process. I know parts of LA and Chicago have them, but the only reason I would ever find out is if there was an outage, so they're probably more widespread than that. Where are you located?

I'm sure you already know this, but it's also important to take in to account the amount of overhead there is in IP and the layers below it. This is especially important to consider in wireless communication, where it's pretty rare, even with a strong signal, to get a message through on the first try. When broadcasting, there's no guarantee that anyone is listening - and even if they are, you can't be sure they're ready to accept what you have to say. Retransmission is inevitable, and it's the primary reason that QoS was introduced in Rev.A - the target of Rev.A is to make wireless data readily accessible, not just possible as they did with Rev.0.

I was in a meeting the other day, and it sounds like they're actually going to go through with Rev.B, after they abandoned it a while ago.

Being that I am completely ignorant in this area, in layman's terms what benefits will Rev.A offer?
Does this involved all phone or more specifically PDA phones?

Quality of Service. Outgoing packets are prioritized according to some logic. It will affect any EV-DO Rev.A enabled device.

[Skywing]

Rev.A definitely includes the increased reverse link bandwidth.  The Qualcomm specifications seem to confirm this, and I've (most certainly) experienced reverse link throughput far beyond that capable in Rev.0 with my Novatel card.

Verizon's press releases [1] claim that they've got all the existing towers transitioned to Rev.A, and I can confirm from personal experience that the KC, KS and Seattle metro areas have it deployed.

[1] http://news.vzw.com/news/2007/06/pr2007-06-28h.html

Edit: For reference, SID 59 (KC, KS), Ch 375 (Cell band), PN 357 is in my current active set for Rev.A here.  Neighbor set at this time included PNs 21, 15, 435, 348, 87, 105, 321, 393, 381, 213, 318, 402, 234, 189.