Salvia Divinorum!

[Towelie]

Garbage

I don't have time to fully respond, but here are a few things you should consider.  Dust-off is completely relevant to the discussion of using inhalants.  Please look it up.  Also, don't tell me what this discussion is supposedly about, and don't put words in my mouth and then argue with them.  Someone else brought up whippets, not me.  And don't make me walk you through the wikipedia entry on whippit.  This started with me reading this thread and a few others, and thinking about how many of the forum users have become embarrassingly undignified and increasingly frequent drug users.  You're the one who thinks salvia isn't a recreational drug.  Perhaps you should read this discussion more carefully. 

brb, spiritual enlightenment

Dust off has NOTHING to do with what he was talking about. Stuff like that is highly dangerous, and the category of inhalants is VERY broad. Whipits are an inhalent, which if you aren't an idiot, that cause you no harm-- DOCTORS use it. I will second leetmuffin with the fact that salvia is NOT a recreational drug. I haven't seen anyone try it who said "I want to do this again. That was awesome!", the experience is just too overly intense and something you don't have to experience every day. In fact, I doubt anyone would do salvia daily, its HIGHLY impractical.

I would guess that about the same amount of damage is done in one hit of salvia as sitting through a 2 hour movie eating popcorn.

How, exactly, did you come up with that comparison?

What I think he is trying to say is that salvia doesn't harm the body any more than if you were to sit around doing nothing.

[Rule]

I would guess that about the same amount of damage is done in one hit of salvia as sitting through a 2 hour movie eating popcorn.

Your completely arbitrary 'guess' instills me with confidence.  Many of these drugs have an insidious effect, especially marijuana.  Also, the conventional wisdom amongst users that marijuana is a harmless drug is wrong.  There are many highly reputable scientific journal articles that are beginning confirm this.  Ten years ago, there was no strong consensus in the scientific community on this issue, but there is now.  Also, there are many rehab centres for marijuana users.  Further, my friend who is a medical doctor and works in a walk in clinic says he will often see people asking him for help trying to get off of marijuana.  Additionally, the whole culture surrounding marijuana use has been found rather destructive.  And it's important to note that marijuana is a very different drug from what it was 30 years ago.

But I'm not interested in a debate about whether marijuana is harmful: it's a great way to derail the point, and it's a debate some users will never give up seeing as how the drug is so unreasonably glorified, which makes for a great rationalisation. Drugs are temporary, and they often do cause damage.  I think a lot of the damage is often from the attitude that develops towards drugs, not necessarily from the drugs themselves.  And the attitude I've been seeing is pathetic. You're never going to do anything permanently good while under the influence of drugs, or while your life becomes a search for the next high.  You're never going to develop in a meaningful way.  Your life will be wasted.  Subjective? Yes.  I suppose it won't be wasted if you are fulfilled with contributing nothing, possibly becoming damaged or dependent, and missing out on a much larger, more interesting world.

[Rule]

Did you read this post? http://www.x86labs.org/forum/index.php/topic,12336.msg155722.html#msg155722

Yes, which was posted after the fact.

No, it was posted before your post that I quoted.

[Rule]

Whipits are an inhalent, which if you aren't an idiot, that cause you no harm-- DOCTORS use it.

Doctors do not use whipit.  They use nitrous oxide.  Calm down little man.

[Warrior]

Did you read this post? http://www.x86labs.org/forum/index.php/topic,12336.msg155722.html#msg155722

Yes, which was posted after the fact.

No, it was posted before your post that I quoted.

It was posted after most of what you had to say was off your chest, obviously if this "clarification" had been made early on then you wouldn't have had the responses you had.

The tune you sing now is a lot different from "a lot of people on this forum are turning into retarded drug users".

[Towelie]

Drugs are temporary, and they often do cause damage.  I think a lot of the damage is often from the attitude the develops towards drugs, not necessarily from the drugs themselves.  And the attitude I've been seeing is pathetic. You're never going to do anything permanently good while under the influence of drugs, or while your life becomes a search for the next high.  You're never going to develop in a meaningful way.  Your life will be wasted.  Subjective? Yes.  I suppose it won't be wasted if you are fulfilled with contributing nothing, possibly becoming damaged or dependent, and missing out on a much larger, more interesting world.

Too bad this only applies to highly addictive drugs and drugs that are highly detrimental to your health and mental well being. I'm yet to meet a stoner who's life fits this description. Great job throwing it in with your debate against marijuana.

[Warrior]

I would guess that about the same amount of damage is done in one hit of salvia as sitting through a 2 hour movie eating popcorn.

Your completely arbitrary 'guess' instills me with confidence.  Many of these drugs have an insidious effect, especially marijuana.  Also, the conventional wisdom amongst users that marijuana is a harmless drug is wrong.  There are many highly reputable scientific journal articles that are beginning confirm this.  Ten years ago, there was no strong consensus in the scientific community on this issue, but there is now.  Also, there are many rehab centres for marijuana users.  Further, my friend who is a medical doctor and works in a walk in clinic says he will often see people asking him for help trying to get off of marijuana.  Additionally, the whole culture surrounding marijuana use has been found rather destructive.  And it's important to note that marijuana is a very different drug from what it was 30 years ago.

But I'm not interested in a debate about whether marijuana is harmful: it's a great way to derail the point, and it's a debate some users will never give up seeing as how the drug is so unreasonably glorified, which makes for a great rationalisation. Drugs are temporary, and they often do cause damage.  I think a lot of the damage is often from the attitude that develops towards drugs, not necessarily from the drugs themselves.  And the attitude I've been seeing is pathetic. You're never going to do anything permanently good while under the influence of drugs, or while your life becomes a search for the next high.  You're never going to develop in a meaningful way.  Your life will be wasted.  Subjective? Yes.  I suppose it won't be wasted if you are fulfilled with contributing nothing, possibly becoming damaged or dependent, and missing out on a much larger, more interesting world.

From that article:

There is increasing research evidence to show that, particularly when someone starts using marijuana in their teens and uses heavily, that marijuana can trigger early onset of psychotic illnesses. For those do become ill, approximately 15% will continue to have psychotic symptoms even after they stop using.

Let me get this straight, first you need to be a heavy user, I don't know anyone here who uses marijuana so heavily (Say 5/7 days of the week, smoking what kind of amounts?) 

Now assuming you're a heavy user you have a chance to have a chance to develop psychotic symptoms. Really? Is this the full extent of the horrible, life destroying, devil drug called marijuana?

Not only is it incredibly unlikely that the circumstances are such for you to even have a chance to develop an early onset, but there is a pretty much well known risk with taking everything without moderation. Marijuana is not very addictive, in fact the addictive qualities are so slight that it feels more like a bad habit after doing it for an extended period of time at regular intervals.

Here, marijuana is found to be the least addictive -- at some point even less addictive than caffine

Come on.

[Rule]

It was posted after most of what you had to say was off your chest, obviously if this "clarification" had been made early on then you wouldn't have had the responses you had.

The tune you sing now is a lot different from "a lot of people on this forum are turning into retarded drug users".

This is what I said:

On a (related) note, why does it seem that everyone on this forum is becoming a retarded drug user?

It's a simple statement of what I -- and obviously others -- felt.  People were then arguing about my position on drugs and legalisation, and freedoms, etc., so I made this post to actually state my position on that issue, frustrated that others were putting words in my mouth about something I haven't said very much about.

[Rule]

From that article...

Is this intentional, or are you daft?  I posted a link to a google search, not to a particular article.

[Warrior]

From that article...

Is this intentional, or are you daft?  I posted a link to a google search, not to a particular article.

You're right, I clicked through to the few articles. This is the article I'm referring to.

[Warrior]

It's a simple statement of what I -- and obviously others -- felt.  People were then arguing about my position on drugs and legalisation, and freedoms, etc., so I made this post to actually state my position on that issue, frustrated that others were putting words in my mouth about something I haven't said very much about.

I never said otherwise, are you going to tell me you didn't expect people to draw their own conclusions from your rather short statement? Turning around and calling them wrong on it isn't very fair, especially when you didn't clarify your positions initially -- you just made a statement which was sure to get you knee-jerk reactions.

[Screenor]

I know, I'm just clarifying that it's only an opinion. :)

It's a reasoned, justified opinion.

In your case, it's just nonsense that you probably don't even believe.

You're right, I like Canada, I go there every year. However it was just an example to show you how flawed your argument is.

[iago]

You're right, I like Canada, I go there every year. However it was just an example to show you how flawed your argument is.

No, it was entirely meaningless.

[abc]

Wow, this post went from just letting you guys know how my first Salvia trip went to a rather large argument.

[Furious]

Salvia is old.  Welcome to 5 years ago.