Eat bacon, burn in Hell?

[Armin]

Well apparently, my mom's got her hands on a book about what we're supposed to eat. Even worse, this book is considered a religious book, which says that God doesn't want us to eat pork, shrimp, crab, lobster, clams, mussels, and many other foods because they're loaded with toxins and are supposedly considered an abdomination just like gay marriage.

Who says any of this is true? Sure, it's written in the bible, but isn't the bible written by man? Also, the bible was written thousands of years ago. Back then, pork was toxic and killed many people. It's said not to be toxic anymore today, but my mom still says, "The bible was written for any time period." I'm agnostic, so for me all of this is just a reason to turn athiest instead of Christian.

Also, anyone have any knowledge on the toxicity levels of any of these meals?

[Newby]

I think it's a joke. I'm not going to base my life around some writings written 2000+ years ago. So much has changed since then...

[Blaze]

this is just a reason to turn athiest instead of Christian.

Join the club.

[Sidoh]

Well apparently, my mom's got her hands on a book about what we're supposed to eat. Even worse, this book is considered a religious book, which says that God doesn't want us to eat pork, shrimp, crab, lobster, clams, mussels, and many other foods because they're loaded with toxins and are supposedly considered an abdomination just like gay marriage.

Who says any of this is true? Sure, it's written in the bible, but isn't the bible written by man? Also, the bible was written thousands of years ago. Back then, pork was toxic and killed many people. It's said not to be toxic anymore today, but my mom still says, "The bible was written for any time period." I'm agnostic, so for me all of this is just a reason to turn athiest instead of Christian.

Also, anyone have any knowledge on the toxicity levels of any of these meals?

People in the Old Testament were required to eat meat that was Kosher.  Times changed in the New Testament, however.  Since this is the newest law provided, it's what people who believe in the New Testament go by.  That's why Jews don't believe in Jesus, still eat Kosher meals, etc.  They don't believe in the New Testament.

Pork isn't toxic in normal quantities.  If it was, I'd be dead.  So would most of the rest of the world.  Everything is toxic, but nothing is.  I saw that quote on a Periodic Table of Elements in my science teacher's room a while ago.  Everything in moderation.

I think it's a joke. I'm not going to base my life around some writings written 2000+ years ago. So much has changed since then...

A book on moral values, relational parables and other things like this (which I've often heard you refer to it as) still applies to this world.  There are obvious reasons behind the laws the bible states.

Sorry for getting all religious, but it's just part of the person I am.

@ The ATHEIST instead of Christian statement:  That book sounds a lot like it's based more off of Judiast ideals than it is Chrisitain ones.  There is a huge difference between the two religions.  That's why Feanor wears a Yamaca and I don't.

[MyndFyre]

Well, Metal, the "reasoning" you have to turn athiest instead of Christian (or any other religion, for that matter) is kind of silly; basing what you believe on what you perceive you can or cannot do versus what is true or false... seems illogical.

You might also want to point out to your mother that she's missing the point of the New Testament (if it's Christianity, not Judaism, that you're referring to).  The old laws (incl. not eating pork) were meant to keep people set apart and pointed to God and God's messenger:

   ⁶But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

   ²⁴So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith.

Furthermore, I think your mom is misled about the eating thing too.  I added emphasis in the following passage:

   ¹⁹Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. ²⁰Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. ²¹It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall.

   ²²So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the man who does not condemn himself by what he approves. ²³But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.

So besides the fact that we are not bound to the law as a condition of salvation, eating of pork (or anything else formerly decreed "unclean") is nullified.  The Romans 14 quote indicates that it isn't whether you eat "clean" or "unclean" foods, but rather whether you have faith that matters.

I think it's a joke. I'm not going to base my life around some writings written 2000+ years ago. So much has changed since then...

That is, of course, your prerogative.  But you have to ask yourself... what if they're true?

I suppose you don't need to ask yourself that question.  It's a valid question nonetheless.  If a man claimed to be God ~2,000 years ago, and it was true, would that be blatantly irrelevant today?  I don't think so.

[Sidoh]

Great argument, MyndFire.  Documented and everything!  :]

[Armin]

x86] link=topic=3233.msg31918#msg31918 date=1128482620]
Well, Metal, the "reasoning" you have to turn athiest instead of Christian (or any other religion, for that matter) is kind of silly; basing what you believe on what you perceive you can or cannot do versus what is true or false... seems illogical.

I'm already agnostic, so I'm not a believer. Being athiest means you basically hate all religion. The only difference is I'd hate Christianity instead of just not believing it because of this rediculous law, but you've made it clear to me it's not a law anymore.

Also, thanks for the great arguement, I'll show my mom it now.

[Armin]

Alright, my mom doesn't want to listen. No matter what I say, she brings up verses from the Old Testament saying that pig is unclean. She just doesn't know how to listen. Any ideas?

[Newby]

Bring up what MyndFyre said and ask her to explain those without the use of the Old Testament.

[Sidoh]

Alright, my mom doesn't want to listen. No matter what I say, she brings up verses from the Old Testament saying that pig is unclean. She just doesn't know how to listen. Any ideas?

Explain to her that people in the Old Testament were to yet to be redeemed through the salvation of Christ's crucifixion.  This is the main reason why times changed so much in the New Testament.

[Armin]

Alright, my mom doesn't want to listen. No matter what I say, she brings up verses from the Old Testament saying that pig is unclean. She just doesn't know how to listen. Any ideas?

Explain to her that people in the Old Testament were to yet to be redeemed through the salvation of Christ's crucifixion.  This is the main reason why times changed so much in the New Testament.

Since I'm not a Christian, you'll have to explain to me why we can now eat pork after Christ's crucifixion. Other than that, seems like it will work if my mom will actually listen to me this time.

[Sidoh]

Since I'm not a Christian, you'll have to explain to me why we can now eat pork after Christ's crucifixion. Other than that, seems like it will work if my mom will actually listen to me this time.

Err.. nevermind.

Metion to her that perhaps God was protecting us from some disease that was present in non-kosher sources of meat during the presence of this law?  Since in Romans it plainly stated that all food is clean, the rule was abolished since there was no longer a concern.

19Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall.

[Armin]

Since I'm not a Christian, you'll have to explain to me why we can now eat pork after Christ's crucifixion. Other than that, seems like it will work if my mom will actually listen to me this time.

Err.. nevermind.

Metion to her that perhaps God was protecting us from some disease that was present in non-kosher sources of meat during the presence of this law?  Since in Romans it plainly stated that all food is clean, the rule was abolished since there was no longer a concern.

19Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall.

She won't believe it unless it's a verse.

[Sidoh]

That was from a verse.  I just said MyndFire's post because I didn't want to find which one he was talking about.  Here:

¹⁹ Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification.

²⁰ Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble.

²¹ It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall.

[Armin]

I know that, I already showed that to her, I was referring to the part about God just protecting us from a disease.