Does smoking kill iagos? All this and more!

[Sidoh]

More than 420 chemicals?  :P

I wouldn't doubt it.

http://www.quit-smoking-stop.com/harmful-chemicals-in-cigarettes.html:

Tobacco smoke contains over 4,000 different chemicals. At least 43 are known carcinogens (cause cancer in humans).

http://ash.org/additives.html:

One news report called the chemicals in tobacco smoke "a lethal cocktail - a horrifying list of toxic chemicals." Another called it "600 poisons in every cigarette."

Tons more: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGGL,GGGL:2005-09,GGGL:en&q=chemicals+in+cigarettes

[MyndFyre]

Split from GameSnake's post.

[Sidoh]

x86] link=topic=4080.msg43507#msg43507 date=1134086993]
Split from GameSnake's post.

Thanks.  I was planning to do this if it carried on for much longer. :)

[iago]

iago: It was on CNN (actually I think there was something on it this year even, due to it happening again) then someone who had never smoked in their life got cancer due to second hand smoke. And weed is just that, a weed, it has nothing to do with tobacco.

I know a cat who's covered in fur who developed skin cancer.  And it wasn't caused by the sun!  Not much is known about cancer, including the cause.  It could be genetic, it could be caused by living in cities that are filled with polutants, it could be just random bad luck.  Who knows?  They need to do a study to prove that people who are exposed to second hand smoke do indeed have a higher rate of lung cancer than people who aren't.  I have yet to see a study that shows that. 

iago, if you don't beleive cigarettes can kill you, do this, or stop arguing:

Go buy some cigarettes, and smoke the whole pack in that day, if they're so un-lethal, I want YOU to be the one doing the test, this way you'll know you're wrong when you're 6 feet under the ground.

If I wanted smoke blown up my ass, I'd be at home with a pack of smokes and a short length of hose. 

But seriously, smoking a single pack of cigarettes isn't good for you, but it's not going to kill you.  The same way that smoking a joint every week or two isn't going to kill you.  It's smoking cigarettes or weed frequently that's the cause, over an extended period of time.  And I've never argued that cigarettes aren't harmful, they definitely are.  But you can't say that second hand smoke is as bad as marijuana smoke, because there's no proof of that.  As I said, it's all propoganda, or smoke and mirrors. 

I don't think iago has ever stated that cigarettes couldn't kill you. If you haven't realized this by now but weed is as bad as tobacco and can kill you faster than tobacco, weed contain 420 chemicals, rather than tobacco only contains nicotine.

That sounds like an awful coincidental number.  Do you have a reliable source on that?

[GameSnake]

Holy shit I really dont belong here after all, hide you bullshit and reveal it when it's safe I guess. I cant convince brainwashed people of the merits of marijuana, I can tell you it has killed no one and is more safe than any other drug you will find that WORKS, but it wont matter the critics are brainwashed, it is as simple as that. I lied about where I live but you people are lying to yourselves if you think you're really above anyone because you cant pull your head out of you ass and be more tolerant of other's choices.

[iago]

Holy shit I really dont belong here after all, hide you bullshit and reveal it when it's safe I guess. I cant convince brainwashed people of the merits of marijuana, I can tell you it has killed no one and is more safe than any other drug you will find that WORKS, but it wont matter the critics are brainwashed, it is as simple as that. I lied about where I live but you people are lying to yourselves if you think you're really above anyone because you cant pull your head out of you ass and be more tolerant of other's choices.

No, you're brainwashed into thinking it's 100% harmless.  Read the rest of what I've said.  I'm not condemning it, I'm trying to take a neutral stance. 

[GameSnake]

You changed your mind really fast there iago since last night. I have too many good things going on in my life to let shit like this get me down, you guys can goto hell, as far as I'm concerned I have apologized and asked for forgiveness from a false source,  you'll realize one day you aren't always right.

[iago]

You changed your mind really fast there iago since last night. I have too many good things going on in my life to let shit like this get me down, you guys can goto hell, as far as I'm concerned I have apologized and asked for forgiveness from a false source, get off the computers and lose some weight and maybe you'll realize one day you aren't always right.

Wow, you get down from the idea that marijuana MIGHT not be healthy?  That's scary. 

Of couse I'm not always right.  But isn't it better to admit that you're wrong instead of people discovering it?  I can tell you that none of the leaders are mad at you for anything.  The members might be a different story. 

[Sidoh]

I know a cat who's covered in fur who developed skin cancer.  And it wasn't caused by the sun!  Not much is known about cancer, including the cause.  It could be genetic, it could be caused by living in cities that are filled with polutants, it could be just random bad luck.  Who knows?  They need to do a study to prove that people who are exposed to second hand smoke do indeed have a higher rate of lung cancer than people who aren't.  I have yet to see a study that shows that. 

I don't think cancer is elusive as you're taking it to be.  It's a simple mutation of a control structure in cells that causes mutated to divide rapidly.  In a normal cell, there is a sort of "check-sum" that verifies the integrity of the gene data stored in the cell.  I would go into more detail, but this was something that was covered in Biochemistry last year; it's been too long for me to remember the specific names of the mechanisms.  If that specific mechanism becomes subject to a mutation, then the cell is free to divide with any sort of mutation.  Seeing as environment can impact the probability of a mutation occurring in a cell (there's actually a small chance that one will occur for every tiny bit of gene data created.  Since there are so many genes in a strand of DNA/RNA, there are almost always a few mutations in cells.  These are generally corrected (or the cell "commits suicide" if they are too bad), but not if the mechanisms that check for these types of things are broken), exposing your body to deemed "toxic" or "dangerous" chemicals (such as the ones contained in cigarettes) can greatly increase the chances that you will contract cancer.  Once one cell has a mechanism disabled which is responsible for controlling the mutations in the cell, it reproduces rapidly and produces what we know as cancer.

The elusive thing about cancer is curing it.  The only real thing we know to do is to remove the infected area of tissue.  When that area of tissue is a large portion of a vital organ (IE Kidney, Liver, etc), it becomes hard to remove it in any sort of timely fashion.

I love my Biology teacher.

Holy shit I really dont belong here after all, hide you bullshit and reveal it when it's safe I guess. I cant convince brainwashed people of the merits of marijuana, I can tell you it has killed no one and is more safe than any other drug you will find that WORKS, but it wont matter the critics are brainwashed, it is as simple as that. I lied about where I live but you people are lying to yourselves if you think you're really above anyone because you cant pull your head out of you ass and be more tolerant of other's choices.

The critics are brainwashed?  Most of the critics of Marijuana are neural, respiratory and circulatory research scientists.  Seeing as most articles published against Marijuana are created by respected doctors and experienced professionals in the field of biological science, I'd trust them over the assuming teenagers and adults that find peace in smoking pot.

You changed your mind really fast there iago since last night. I have too many good things going on in my life to let shit like this get me down, you guys can goto hell, as far as I'm concerned I have apologized and asked for forgiveness from a false source, get off the computers and lose some weight and maybe you'll realize one day you aren't always right.

Yuck, that was a horrible thing to say.  I don't personally appreciate you downgrading any sort of person over such a silly argument.  Besides, where did he say he was always right?  He's defending his position in a perfectly legitimate way and you're trying to tear him down with personal insults.  Don't do that, it's stupid.

[iago]

I know a cat who's covered in fur who developed skin cancer.  And it wasn't caused by the sun!  Not much is known about cancer, including the cause.  It could be genetic, it could be caused by living in cities that are filled with polutants, it could be just random bad luck.  Who knows?  They need to do a study to prove that people who are exposed to second hand smoke do indeed have a higher rate of lung cancer than people who aren't.  I have yet to see a study that shows that. 

I don't think cancer is elusive as you're taking it to be.  It's a simple mutation of a control structure in cells that causes mutated to divide rapidly.  In a normal cell, there is a sort of "check-sum" that verifies the integrity of the gene data stored in the cell.  I would go into more detail, but this was something that was covered in Biochemistry last year; it's been too long for me to remember the specific names of the mechanisms.  If that specific mechanism becomes subject to a mutation, then the cell is free to divide with any sort of mutation.  Seeing as environment can impact the probability of a mutation occurring in a cell (there's actually a small chance that one will occur for every tiny bit of gene data created.  Since there are so many genes in a strand of DNA/RNA, there are almost always a few mutations in cells.  These are generally corrected (or the cell "commits suicide" if they are too bad), but not if the mechanisms that check for these types of things are broken), exposing your body to deemed "toxic" or "dangerous" chemicals (such as the ones contained in cigarettes) can greatly increase the chances that you will contract cancer.  Once one cell has a mechanism disabled which is responsible for controlling the mutations in the cell, it reproduces rapidly and produces what we know as cancer.

I love my Biology teacher.

It harmful chemicals can cause cancer, then why aren't we all terrified of car exhaust? Or the fumes given off by tar?  Or even factories?

I'm exposed to car exhast constantly. 

In hot weather, roads frequently smell of tar.  And, in the summer, when they pave roads, they have factories that make ashfault, which give off tons of fumes. 

There are plenty of factories which billow fumes into residential neighborhoods. 

Any of these could be the cause of lung cancer.  First hand smoke most likely DOES cause cancer.  But there is no evidence that second hand smoke does.  Second hand smoke is much less dense than first hand, so it's not like there's as many chemicals.  Second hand smoke is comparable to the exhuast you inhale walking down the street. 

I got sidetracked and forget what I was going to say, so screw it.

[Sidoh]

It harmful chemicals can cause cancer, then why aren't we all terrified of car exhaust? Or the fumes given off by tar?  Or even factories?

I'm exposed to car exhast constantly. 

In hot weather, roads frequently smell of tar.  And, in the summer, when they pave roads, they have factories that make ashfault, which give off tons of fumes. 

There are plenty of factories which billow fumes into residential neighborhoods. 

Any of these could be the cause of lung cancer.  First hand smoke most likely DOES cause cancer.  But there is no evidence that second hand smoke does.  Second hand smoke is much less dense than first hand, so it's not like there's as many chemicals.  Second hand smoke is comparable to the exhuast you inhale walking down the street. 

I got sidetracked and forget what I was going to say, so screw it.

Very true.

However, in this case, it's a matter of concentration.  We're breathing a lot more air than we're breathing car exhaust when we go outside.  Same with the factories, tar, etc.

When you smoke a cigarette, you're inhaling almost pure smoke.  When you go outside on a hot summer day, you may be able to smell the tar, but it's in much lower concentration than cigarette smoke is in.

[iago]

It harmful chemicals can cause cancer, then why aren't we all terrified of car exhaust? Or the fumes given off by tar?  Or even factories?

I'm exposed to car exhast constantly. 

In hot weather, roads frequently smell of tar.  And, in the summer, when they pave roads, they have factories that make ashfault, which give off tons of fumes. 

There are plenty of factories which billow fumes into residential neighborhoods. 

Any of these could be the cause of lung cancer.  First hand smoke most likely DOES cause cancer.  But there is no evidence that second hand smoke does.  Second hand smoke is much less dense than first hand, so it's not like there's as many chemicals.  Second hand smoke is comparable to the exhuast you inhale walking down the street. 

I got sidetracked and forget what I was going to say, so screw it.

Very true.

However, in this case, it's a matter of concentration.  We're breathing a lot more air than we're breathing car exhaust when we go outside.  Same with the factories, tar, etc.

When you smoke a cigarette, you're inhaling almost pure smoke.  When you go outside on a hot summer day, you may be able to smell the tar, but it's in much lower concentration than cigarette smoke is in.

Agreed.  And I'll agree that first hand smoke will almost certainly kill.  If not, it's certainly not good for you.

The issue at hand is Second-hand smoke.  It's also not good for you, but will it kill you?  I don't know. 

[Sidoh]

Agreed.  And I'll agree that first hand smoke will almost certainly kill.  If not, it's certainly not good for you.

The issue at hand is Second-hand smoke.  It's also not good for you, but will it kill you?  I don't know.

I'm pretty sure there is proven, documented evidence that second-hand smoke is an accepted cause of several respiratory diseases.

[iago]

Agreed.  And I'll agree that first hand smoke will almost certainly kill.  If not, it's certainly not good for you.

The issue at hand is Second-hand smoke.  It's also not good for you, but will it kill you?  I don't know.

I'm pretty sure there is proven, documented evidence that second-hand smoke is an accepted cause of several respiratory diseases.

I am aware of no such evidence.  In every document I've seen about second hand smoke being dangerous, references are either circular or non-existant.  I've never seen one that actually refers to a real study. 

[Sidoh]

I am aware of no such evidence.  In every document I've seen about second hand smoke being dangerous, references are either circular or non-existant.  I've never seen one that actually refers to a real study.

Seeing as second-hand smoke is smoke that's come out of the cigarette without going through the filter, I don't see how it could be any less harming than the smoke inhaled from the head of the cigarette.

Additionally, the correct plural of "iago" is "iagi".