The Wierdest Thing You Will Ever Hear Me Ask

[Kaleeko]

I say weird because, simply, I am usually not the type to ask for relationship advice, especially from a group of nerds such as yourself. (That's a compliment.)

If you didn't know, my boyfriend and I broke up about two weeks ago. It was a rather peaceful breakup, except for the fact that it was completely out of the blue, and unprovoked. While I was prepared to spend the rest of my life with David -- and was under the complete speculation that he felt the same way -- he apparently changed his mind and suddenly fell out of love with me. For no reason. He just *stopped*.

There are some things I understand about guys.. This isn't one of them. How does someone, one week, leave messages on your phone saying "I don't have words to describe how much I love you" and "you and I are made for each other" and "I never want to be with anyone else, or see you with anyone else", and then, almost exactly a week later, feel the exact opposite?

Seriously, you think girls are fucked up? That's just... Fucked up.

[Newby]

.

[Joe]

Dr Joe, PhD, delivers his diagnosis.


(23:47:02) [x86] Joe: I'm sorry for my insensitivity in this, but I'll agree: Boy's are fucked up.
(23:47:32) [x86] Joe: Now, to make up for that insensitivity (although unsubtle), sorry to hear about that.
(23:47:46) Kaleeko: Haha.
(23:47:48) Kaleeko: Well, thanks/
(23:47:57) [x86] Joe: Unfortunately (fortunately?) I've never dated a guy, so I don't know.
(23:48:28) [x86] Joe: Now to make myself sound like an ass, if he would gom from pont A to.. point negative A in one week, he probably wasn't worth it.
(23:48:38) [x86] Joe: Not gom. Go, even.

[Sidoh]

Dr Joe, PhD, delivers his diagnosis.

Yeah, you have a "PhD in BS:" Piled high and deep in bull shit.  What you've shown there is nothing more than a display of sympathy.


I'm going to be blunt.  Please don't take anything harshly or think I'm accusing you of anything.

I'll state the obvious.  Aside from being totally unreasonable or insane, the only reasons I can think of for such a sudden change in feelings are: a realization of some sort, a rumor he heard, something you said that effected him in such a way or something he witnessed.  This obviously isn't an exhaustive list, but it should get the point across.

That being said, there are quite a few logical reasons that he could so spontaneously change his mind about something so serious.  I strongly suggest you ask him.  I find it unbelievably unlikely that he "just stopped" loving you.  I propose that there's nearly always a simple reason for this, especially when it is this sudden.  It may end up being a waste of your time, but it could also be one of the best things you do for your relationship with David.

All the best, Kaleeko.

[Kaleeko]

I've tried asking him what the change was, and his answer has been, always been, that he doesn't know. That he suddenly realized one day that he wasn't romantically attracted to me anymore. That he suddenly realized I "wasn't the one for him". Granted, there were some things that were wrong with our relationship, but they were things we were working out to the point where they were hardly issues anymore.

But, considering all this to be true, I still can't understand how someone can change so quickly, especially with a feeling so strong. I won't exhaust myself explaining how, but the depth for which he felt, at least what expressed, for me was something very profound. It wasn't just another relationship. We'd even gone so far as basically deciding we wanted to spend the rest of our lives together, barring anything supernatural happening. Well, the supernatural happened.

I'm still trying to see whether this was a good thing or not. It's kind of hard to tell right now.

[Super_X]

That's really too bad, dude.. But, As I've told you many many times before, Guys suck. Sorry for his loss, Ma'am.

[Krazed]

Hrm. Fuck relationships, but anyway. Theres another girl IMO. Fuck him, he's not worth it.

[Armin]

It was definitely a realization like Sidoh said, yet it doesn't always have to be something you do. He could've realized that he only thought he loved you all this time, possibly because he didn't give it as much thought as something like this requires..

[Furious]

Maybe he realized he wasn't ready ( to commit himself to you ) and got scared.

[CrAz3D]

PEOPLE are fucked up.  (I'm still pretty jacked re:the girl I love & that "loved" me & "didnt want to do anything to mess it up", cheated on me........but I take comfort in her being recently fired & dating some wetback)

and yeah, there has got to be some underlying circumstances as to what made him change his mind.
Family issues, soon-to-be attending college & moving away issues?
...I would think the possibility of moving away for college would be a BIG thing (if thats even in the question)

If he won't talk about it completely & honestly, well, maybe he wasn't invested enough in you (nor is he worth your time).

you're cute, go find a decent person to date.

[ZeroX]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

[CrAz3D]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

...you sound bitter/sarcastic...and since I can't remember who her b/f was on here, was it you?
(I'm like 85% its Sty though)....just checkin

[Newby]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

...you sound bitter/sarcastic...and since I can't remember who her b/f was on here, was it you?
(I'm like 85% its Sty though)....just checkin

Neither.

[trust]

I was actually in a similar (by similar I mean pretty much exact same) situation, where my exgirlfriend was you and I was your exboyfriend. My best piece of advice is don't call him and start crying weeks or days later, or ask him what you did wrong, etc. It'll make him start to despise you and you'll just be worse off. Just accept it and move on, time heals all wounds as they say.

It's crazy and hard to understand I know, liking someone so much one day and not at all the next. But it does happen, and it is possible. Most likely though he started to find things wrong with you, things he was blinded to at the beginning and in the period of initial lust. At first he can cope with these things but eventually they add up and become overwhelming. He begins to realize that you are in fact not the "one" and wants to end it before he leads you on any further.

I'm sorry for your situation, but in the end it's probably for the best. You may love him, but as they say..it takes two to tango.

[iago]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

That's what I was thinking, but in a less cynical way.

As a guy, I'll say whatever I think I'm supposed to say to avoid being yelled at. I have at least one female friend (not romantic, mind) who doesn't know me at all, everything I talk about with her is more or less a facade. But I say what I'm supposed to say, and she thinks I'm awesome.

I don't know if that's the same kind of situation. I am reasonably sure that I wouldn't be able to tell her "bye" easily, for fear that she'd kill me.

But what it really comes down to is what ZeroX said -- many guys will say whatever they think they're supposed to say, not necessarily what they think.

[trust]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

I totally agree with this too. I think sex should be something that you get out of the way early on because it just creates problems and lies. If anyone remembers when my ex stole those earrings, I was pretty much completely through with her and didn't see her as good enough for me or worth my time. However, I still liked her some and I also knew that she would eventually give it up. She did. Afterwards, there was really no more reason to continue. It lasted maybe a couple more months or so, but I realized that sex really wasn't worth being unhappy with her.

It's pretty bad that guys think this way (Putting up a certain front to get laid) but really, it's instinctive I think. Any male of a species duty is to have sex with as many females as possible because it maximizes the chances of reproducing. If you have sex at the beginning of the relationship then the male has nothing really to go for so you can see if he'll just move on or if he'll stick around. If he sticks around then I think it'll be a good relationship.

[CrAz3D]

hmm..............................................

I regard sex more highly than that.  I have a more intimate feeling towards it.
but to each his own

[Ender]

Words are cheap. Don't put all your faith in them unless you have reason to believe that the person is completely honest. Now, that doesn't mean you can't trust the person with anything if you don't know whether he or she is completely honest. It just means you can't trust him or her with certain things, which is different than just trust), and love is one of those things. There's a difference between trust and complete trust. There are people in my life who have my complete trust and there are others who only have partial trust from me.

Oh, and force him to tell you. Not physically of course, but ask him first, innocuously, and if he refuses to give an answer, tell him how much he hurt you emotionally and guilt-trip him into giving you an answer. If he ends up not giving any answer, then you should maybe consider that he just wanted the sex.

I think you should also reexamine your own reasons for falling in love with him, not just his reasons for falling in and out of love with you.

By the way, I go for friendship before dating. But I'm 0 for 3 so either my good looks are scaring them away or I must not know wtf I'm doing...

[trust]

hmm..............................................

I regard sex more highly than that.  I have a more intimate feeling towards it.
but to each his own

Maybe it's just because I couldn't stand the girl, I don't know. I didn't have any intimate feeling towards it at all, ever.

Oh, and force him to tell you. Not physically of course, but ask him first, innocuously, and if he refuses to give an answer, tell him how much he hurt you emotionally and guilt-trip him into giving you an answer. If he ends up not giving any answer, then you should maybe consider that he just wanted the sex.

No, don't listen to this. It will take you from being able to be friends still to not being on speaking terms, unless he has a really good reason which he probably doesn't - other than "love fades."

[iago]

hmm..............................................

I regard sex more highly than that.  I have a more intimate feeling towards it.
but to each his own

That's a nice thought, but I'm reasonably sure that that feeling is artificial, people feel it because we know we're supposed to.

Of course, I'm a little cynical..

[ZeroX]

Yeah iam sorry if that came out kinda unsenestive to you Kal. I love you and you know this. But thats how I saw the situation you explained coming down too. He was horny and yeah he was going to do what ever he could to get what he wanted and disregard your feelings. 

[CrAz3D]

hmm..............................................

I regard sex more highly than that.  I have a more intimate feeling towards it.
but to each his own

That's a nice thought, but I'm reasonably sure that that feeling is artificial, people feel it because we know we're supposed to.

Of course, I'm a little cynical..

it might be a culturally instilled emotion, but its still pretty real to me.
...ALTHOUGH, it might just be that I feel this way because it was sorta used against me(?) & I'm jealous(ish) re:it...all very possible.

[Joe]

I love you and you know this.

Aww!! But..

* Joe[x86] embraces Kaleeko. "Mine!"

Back off!

But thats how I saw the situation you explained coming down too. He was horny and yeah he was going to do what ever he could to get what he wanted and disregard your feelings. 

Damn he was horny for a long time.

[d&q]

I love you and you know this.

Aww!! But..

* Joe[x86] embraces Kaleeko. "Mine!"

Back off!

You are way too damn desperate.

[Newby]

I love you and you know this.

Aww!! But..

* Joe[x86] embraces Kaleeko. "Mine!"

Back off!

You are way too damn desperate.

Signed.

[Sidoh]

Aww!! But..

* Joe[x86] embraces Kaleeko. "Mine!"

Back off!

You are a giant bag of douche.


iago, I totally agree with you.  I don't think you're cynical; I think you're brutally honest!

[Explicit]

It's simple... things in and of nature can't help being what they are.

[Furious]

Its simple. He wanted some pussy. He texted you some sweet nothings and told you what you wanted to hear. Once he got what he wanted he was done.

I totally agree with this too. I think sex should be something that you get out of the way early on because it just creates problems and lies. If anyone remembers when my ex stole those earrings, I was pretty much completely through with her and didn't see her as good enough for me or worth my time. However, I still liked her some and I also knew that she would eventually give it up. She did. Afterwards, there was really no more reason to continue. It lasted maybe a couple more months or so, but I realized that sex really wasn't worth being unhappy with her.

It's pretty bad that guys think this way (Putting up a certain front to get laid) but really, it's instinctive I think. Any male of a species duty is to have sex with as many females as possible because it maximizes the chances of reproducing. If you have sex at the beginning of the relationship then the male has nothing really to go for so you can see if he'll just move on or if he'll stick around. If he sticks around then I think it'll be a good relationship.

Sad but true.  We are naturally uber horny.

[iago]

It's simple... things in and of nature can't help being what they are.

That, I disagree with.

I think that human nature is rather bad, by default. Humans tend to be greedy, selfish, and, like somebody said above, human males want to have sex with everything. That's how nature made us, because those are survival characteristics.

But in the modern world, we're told that those are bad attributes. So we grow up ignoring our nature and believing in things like "love" and "marriage" to the point where people think those are natural and the way it's meant to be.

Of course, tons of men cheat, and tons of marriages fall apart. That's human nature asserting itself. But a lot of them stay together, which shows that "things in and of nature CAN help being what they are".

[Armin]

So, I'd probably take Kaleeko's lack of responses as a hint.

[ZeroX]

So, I'd probably take Kaleeko's lack of responses as a hint.

/signed

[Explicit]

It's simple... things in and of nature can't help being what they are.

That, I disagree with.

I think that human nature is rather bad, by default. Humans tend to be greedy, selfish, and, like somebody said above, human males want to have sex with everything. That's how nature made us, because those are survival characteristics.

But in the modern world, we're told that those are bad attributes. So we grow up ignoring our nature and believing in things like "love" and "marriage" to the point where people think those are natural and the way it's meant to be.

Of course, tons of men cheat, and tons of marriages fall apart. That's human nature asserting itself. But a lot of them stay together, which shows that "things in and of nature CAN help being what they are".

I actually consider what you said to be a part of nature also, that is, human nature.

[iago]

I actually consider what you said to be a part of nature also, that is, human nature.

Which part of what I said? I talked about both sides..

[Explicit]

I actually consider what you said to be a part of nature also, that is, human nature.

Which part of what I said? I talked about both sides..

Oh, I meant your view on it.  Sorry, I should've clarified.

[Joe]

It's part of human nature to prove you're right no matter how much you need to bend the truth, too.

Well, male nature.

[d&q]

All of this generalizing about males has really started to vex me. Have any of you postulated that these "general male characteristics" are attributes of you, and you alone?

Joe, I do not need to prove I am right no matter what, and I am not fucked up. Furious, I am not intrinsically "uber horny". Super X and Crazed, I do not understand how you can attest that boys and people in general are fucked up. These generalizations are unwarranted and ineffectual. Trust, not all guys need to put up a front to get laid, and it is definitely not proven to be instinctive. We are not wild animals, not even in the heat of passion. Unless you hold some degree in Sociology or something of that nature, how can you possibly assert that males are only driven by their dick? Frankly, I do not believe anyone here (including me) know the true idiosyncrasies of human nature, because for every example given, I can conjure numerous counterexamples.

Regardless, none of this seems to actually remedy the situation. Blaming her breakup on male nature is a clichéd and persistent tactic used to cheer a disconsolate girl, but I have noticed that it does not seem to work, it only projects you as an understanding male who empathizes with her frustration of men. Maybe instead of trying to subconsciously win yourself into her favor (*cough* Joe, ZeroX), you might actually give her advice that matters? However, the fault is not all yours. Kaleeko loaded the question by assuming that all boys were fucked up in the first place. I sympathize with her situation, but blaming it on boys is not going to ameliorate the predicament, and might only make it worse. Truthfully, to provide actual advice, everyone here should know much more about David(the ex-boyfriend) and the relationship as a whole. Exactly how long were they dating? How long after they started dating did they wait to have sex? Would he usually say things such as "I love you" unprovoked, or would he say it because she had or maybe just to win her consideration? What other evidence are there of him genuinely loving her? When they talked about their distant futures, was he the one who brought it up, or was it her? If he did, did he seem sincerely excited? There are so many questions to be asked if we want to effectively help the situation, and itt would be preferable if we actually knew David/Kaleeko, since it would answer most, if not all, these essential questions. That is the predominant reason why asking for help over the internet is generally a bad idea. It is not just because everyone here is an immature boy-nerd, or whatever explanation is generally flaunted. Many people here seem to be in deep, committed relationships (MyndFyre, unTactical, possibly Hitmen???), so that our maturity (or lack thereof), is obviously not the problem. Kaleeko probably understands this, and that could be why there has not been a response as of late.

[CrAz3D]

All of this generalizing about males has really started to vex me. Have any of you postulated that these "general male characteristics" are attributes of you, and you alone?

Crazed, I do not understand how you can attest people in general are fucked up.

What other social group of beings will intentionally and pointlessly kill members of its own group?
What other social group of beings has the awareness of others but still is able to betray the trust of others?

People, in general, are fucked up.

[d&q]

All of this generalizing about males has really started to vex me. Have any of you postulated that these "general male characteristics" are attributes of you, and you alone?

Crazed, I do not understand how you can attest people in general are fucked up.

What other social group of beings will intentionally and pointlessly kill members of its own group?
What other social group of beings has the awareness of others but still is able to betray the trust of others?

People, in general, are fucked up.

All that means is that many people have the capability of doing atrocious things, not that every single individual is "fucked up". Somehow, I do not believe you understand what I am saying. You are generalizing, which in some cases, is not a good thing.

[CrAz3D]

I didnt say everyone did it, I generalized (like you said).
Just because its a generalization doesnt mean its not true

[d&q]

I didnt say everyone did it, I generalized (like you said).
Just because its a generalization doesnt mean its not true

Ugh..do you know what you're doing? You're automatically assuming that the person in question(David), is fucked up, due to your generalization that all people are fucked up! That is not even logical. You have no proof to back that up. Your statement about killing and betraying proves nothing.

[CrAz3D]

I didnt say everyone did it, I generalized (like you said).
Just because its a generalization doesnt mean its not true

Ugh..do you know what you're doing? You're automatically assuming that the person in question(David), is fucked up, due to your generalization that all people are fucked up! That is not even logical. You have no proof to back that up. Your statement about killing and betraying proves nothing.

I didnt say he WAS, I dont know the dude.  I'm just saying its quite possible

[Furious]

I didnt say everyone did it, I generalized (like you said).
Just because its a generalization doesnt mean its not true

Ugh..do you know what you're doing? You're automatically assuming that the person in question(David), is fucked up, due to your generalization that all people are fucked up! That is not even logical. You have no proof to back that up. Your statement about killing and betraying proves nothing.

You're 15.  When you hit puberty feel free to come back and talk.

[d&q]

Yeah, you have no idea what the hell you're talking about. When you stop assuming things and start growing up, maybe then someone can hold an intelligent discussion with you.

[Furious]

Yeah, you have no idea what the hell you're talking about. When you stop assuming things and start growing up, maybe then someone can hold an intelligent discussion with you.

Really? Odd.  I'm the one in the long term meaningful relationship, I have a daughter, and I am the person people generally come to when they are having problems.  But hey, I'll listen to the middle schooler who has way more life experience then me.

[d&q]

Ah I see, you're the one people come to. Probably not because you've had some major problems in your life, such as unexpected pregnancies (Hmm, I'm probably inferring too much about something I don't know about; sound familiar?). You're obviously not a very smart person if you think I'm still in middle school at 15 years, but I would not expect that from so biased and ignorant. Someone at 25 can argue that at your age, your meaningful relationship is probably not as "meaningful" as it seems. Regardless of my age, you have absolutely no idea what life I have led, or what things I have experienced. Immigrating at a young age and being poor for a large portion of your life forces you to grow up very fast. Obviously, you would know nothing about that, since you don't know or care about my past or anything that provides evidence supporting my claims. Nothing I have said requires me to be 5 years older and have a damn kid. It is quite evident that there are some things that you need to be older to speak authoritatively about, but that definitely does not apply here. Love is something that can be experienced at a young age, it just so happens that at one's youth, you more often identify lust as love. Most of my classmates and friends are at least 17, and I can honestly say that some act as immature as my 6 year old cousin. However, there are those that act more mature than my teachers.

Speaking of age, isn't Kaleeko a mere two years older? I haven't seen you say that she is clueless adolescent who doesn't know what she is talking about. Maybe seeing someone younger who has something good to say pisses you off. Or maybe in your life most of the younger people you've met have been hopelessly immature. If that is the case, I feel sorry for you, since you are living in a secluded, nescient world where you cannot even acknowledge logical and truthful advice from someone younger(and indubitably less mature) than you. Honestly, when some here express distaste towards you for being so young and a father, I usually sympathize and understand your situation. For you to turn around and do the same to me fills me with disgust.

[trust]

Trust, not all guys need to put up a front to get laid, and it is definitely not proven to be instinctive. We are not wild animals, not even in the heat of passion. Unless you hold some degree in Sociology or something of that nature, how can you possibly assert that males are only driven by their dick?

While it's true that I didn't retain much from AP Biology last year, I do remember being taught that the need to reproduce is the driving force of any species. Many different animals go through elaborate courtship ceremonies to woo either the male or female into procreating with them. This is no different in our species, and is done through physical appearance (clothing, hair, etc.) and temporarily altering ones personality (pretending to like something, being in that initial "love bug" stage where everything is perfect, etc.). If it comes down to either getting laid by telling someone you love them, or not getting laid by remaining silent...we're instinctively going to say we love them, even if it's not true...because it's what is required of us to continue our species. While you may argue that you aren't a wild animal and don't have these urges, it's not true...it's still something that we think about on the subconscious level. And even though most of us are having sex with the idea of pleasure in mind and not reproduction, the biological part of us doesn't think that way.

[d&q]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

[Explicit]

Trust, not all guys need to put up a front to get laid, and it is definitely not proven to be instinctive. We are not wild animals, not even in the heat of passion. Unless you hold some degree in Sociology or something of that nature, how can you possibly assert that males are only driven by their dick?

While it's true that I didn't retain much from AP Biology last year, I do remember being taught that the need to reproduce is the driving force of any species. Many different animals go through elaborate courtship ceremonies to woo either the male or female into procreating with them. This is no different in our species, and is done through physical appearance (clothing, hair, etc.) and temporarily altering ones personality (pretending to like something, being in that initial "love bug" stage where everything is perfect, etc.). If it comes down to either getting laid by telling someone you love them, or not getting laid by remaining silent...we're instinctively going to say we love them, even if it's not true...because it's what is required of us to continue our species. While you may argue that you aren't a wild animal and don't have these urges, it's not true...it's still something that we think about on the subconscious level. And even though most of us are having sex with the idea of pleasure in mind and not reproduction, the biological part of us doesn't think that way.

It's really the fact that people can and do resist the urge to rip off their clothes and engage in steamy-hot sex in a phone booth with a gorgeous looking woman (or man, if that's what you're into) that sets us apart from all other species.  That, and we have the thought capacity to weigh out the various consequences that could come as a result of giving into "the urge".

[CrAz3D]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

maybe most people arent as ub3r 1337 as you...

[trust]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

I'm willing to bet that societal boundaries play more of a role in suppressing instinct than evolved logic and intelligence.

[Explicit]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

I'm willing to bet that societal boundaries play more of a role in suppressing instinct than evolved logic and intelligence.

Aren't societal boundaries a product of logic and intelligence?

[d&q]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

maybe most people arent as ub3r 1337 as you...

Sorry, I think I worded it incorrectly. As humans, we, as Explicit said, are able to judge the consequences of our actions and act appropriately. I said that's how it is specifically for me as not to generalize.

[CrAz3D]

but seriously, not all people are as logical as the next.

I have friends purposefully & knowing drink until they cant stand...get sick...and do it all over again the next night.
My ex purposefully & knowingly got drunk to the point to where (she knew beforehand) she couldnt control herself & went and cheated on me...then didnt tell me...then lied to my face...then continued to 'toy' with my emotions.

Logic isn't always (or even mostly I'd say) the prevailing factor in why people do things.

[trust]

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

I'm willing to bet that societal boundaries play more of a role in suppressing instinct than evolved logic and intelligence.

Aren't societal boundaries a product of logic and intelligence?

I think that could be argued, but in any case it doesn't remove the subconscious playing a role in decision making.

[Explicit]

but seriously, not all people are as logical as the next.

I have friends purposefully & knowing drink until they cant stand...get sick...and do it all over again the next night.
My ex purposefully & knowingly got drunk to the point to where (she knew beforehand) she couldnt control herself & went and cheated on me...then didnt tell me...then lied to my face...then continued to 'toy' with my emotions.

Logic isn't always (or even mostly I'd say) the prevailing factor in why people do things.

It's not so much the fact that they aren't as "logical" as the next person, but more that they are actually fully capable of thinking logically.  If someone is mentally unstable, then that I can understand, but otherwise, it's no excuse.

I did not mean that we do not have instinctual urges, but rather in many people, our evolved logic and intelligence can dominate it. At least, that is the case for me.

I'm willing to bet that societal boundaries play more of a role in suppressing instinct than evolved logic and intelligence.

Aren't societal boundaries a product of logic and intelligence?

I think that could be argued, but in any case it doesn't remove the subconscious playing a role in decision making.

It doesn't have to remove the subconscious.

[Kaleeko]

Sorry it took me so long to respond. Been playing so much WoW lately, I completely forgot I even wrote this post... Amazing.

Anyways, thank you all a lot for your opinions. I haven't gotten to read all of them completely yet, but I've sort of gotten the jist of it all. Right now, it's still pretty hard, but, the fact that I know some people still care about me, and that he's probably just being a typical guy -- and not the perfect being I thought he was -- makes it a lot easier to get over him. It's amazing how a bunch of nerds can make me feel better all at once. How cute.

If anything, this was a learning experience for me, to not put all my eggs in one basket.  I was out of school for three weeks because of how physically sick I became over the stress from this.. Something that shouldn't happen normally and makes me feel pretty stupid for. The guy was amazing, but only in that he was so much better than anything I've ever had. He raised my standards. Now, I know what to expect, and what to look for a lot more. Even if it doesn't feel that way now, I came out better than I went in. No matter how amazing he was, there's someone more amazing out there.

All you guys should remember that in the future, I guess. Cept, the other way around... Yeah. Girl guy-guy girl thing. Whatever. I'm going to stop talking.

[CrAz3D]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

[ZeroX]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

[Armin]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

For one, there's more sex. And if you actually find a woman that's cool, you'll have conversation.

[Furious]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

For one, there's more sex. And if you actually find a woman that's cool, you'll have conversation.

+1

-or-

/signed as Zero would say

[CrAz3D]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

For one, there's more sex. And if you actually find a woman that's cool, you'll have conversation.

+1

-or-

/signed as Zero would say

+1//signed also

Having someone to be able to talk about anything, or even nothing, with is the best feeling.  I miss having someone I can talk (or not talk) with.  Just a REALLY good friend thats always there.

[Kaleeko]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

Can I say... shallow?

In my book, anything that ISN'T a relationship is a waste of time and effort. While I can't say that I love people, a lot of the reason I keep going day to day is the relationships I have with others -- friends, family, and every once in a while, someone special enough to deserve a little (or lot) bit more. I find it offensive to think that you honestly can't see that.

Although, now, I'm formulating a deep relationship with Sheridan of Babylon 5. I'm sure it will be long, fruitful, and incredibly hard to disrupt. Ah, sci-fi. ^^

[disco]

hope you work stuff out best for you

you seem like a cool chick, and look pretty damned cuyte as i recall from poictures.....
....yeah, after i found out my exbitch fucking cheated on me i became physically sick for a week or some, so lame.

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

How can you think that!?  There's way more to a good relationship than sex.  If you're with someone who you truly enjoy being with and doing things with, then sex should just be a benefit; not the other way around.

[Sidoh]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

[CrAz3D]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

...he might be half right, after all 50% of marriages end in divorce !

[Sidoh]

...he might be half right, after all 50% of marriages end in divorce !

I don't think that makes a universal conclusion "half right."

[CrAz3D]

...he might be half right, after all 50% of marriages end in divorce !

I don't think that makes a universal conclusion "half right."

[Furious]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

[CrAz3D]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

no you couldnt

[Sidoh]

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

I don't think that argument makes much sense.

[Chavo]

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

This is actually partly correct.  From the Catholic Catechism:

1601 "The matrimonial covenant, by which a man and a woman establish between themselves a partnership of the whole of life, is by its nature ordered toward the good of the spouses and the procreation and education of offspring; this covenant between baptized persons has been raised by Christ the Lord to the dignity of a sacrament."84

The part you are missing is that the church also teaches that sex is an act of pure love but should only be done with an 'open to life' attitude.  This is true for Catholics anyway, I know that Methodists and Baptists both have different views on the subject.

[ZeroX]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

[Sidoh]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

67% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

Seriously, you're young and inexperienced.  How the hell can you say that with any amount of validity?

[Explicit]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

67% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

Seriously, you're young and inexperienced. How the hell can you say that with any amount of validity?

You took the words right out of my fingertips.

[CrAz3D]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

67% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

Seriously, you're young and inexperienced.  How the hell can you say that with any amount of validity?

pssst, he's probably a liberal

but for reals, he's gay.  gay people are CRAZY

[ZeroX]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

67% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

Seriously, you're young and inexperienced.  How the hell can you say that with any amount of validity?

Dont take the next statement to harshly. I have nothing but respect for you.

How are you going to act as if your an "Elder" to myself and have life experience in this matter. Your not that much older then me, Iam guessing early 20's? Sidoh your one more Intelligent people I met over the interweb and I really dont think that you would have time to balance a meaningful relationship ontop of trying to figure out all of Newton's Laws and for quite awhile up until recently play WoW.

But what do I know. I dont know you well enough too know if in fact you did or even still do have a Girlfriend so just making a simple observation. 

pssst, he's probably a liberal

but for reals, he's gay.  gay people are CRAZY

Your gay =[

[Sidoh]

he's probably a liberal

I know quite a few liberals who aren't nearly that cynical.

[ZeroX]

he's probably a liberal

I know quite a few liberals who aren't nearly that cynical.

I am not cynical.

[Sidoh]

I am not cynical.

The opinion you presented is absolutely cynical.

[Furious]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

no you couldnt

Sure I could - why else does everyone( I know not EVERYONE, but you get the point ) get married and 'fornicate' on their honeymoon, why not just wait and only do it when they want a child?

[Sidoh]

Dont take the next statement to harshly. I have nothing but respect for you.

How are you going to act as if your an "Elder" to myself and have life experience in this matter. Your not that much older then me, Iam guessing early 20's? Sidoh your one more Intelligent people I met over the interweb and I really dont think that you would have time to balance a meaningful relationship ontop of trying to figure out all of Newton's Laws and for quite awhile up until recently play WoW.

But what do I know. I dont know you well enough too know if in fact you did or even still do have a Girlfriend so just making a simple observation. 

I'm 19.  I'm not in a relationship, but that doesn't lead me to immediately deny that sincere love exists.

[Joe]

When you let someone like that control your emotions as you did CrAz3D thats when stuff gets unhealthy and I am not surpised that you did get sick over some stupid bitch. Realtionships in my book are just a compelte waste of time and effort. After the fucking what else is their to look forward too?

If this was at all true, why would marriage exist?  Becoming emotionally ill over a breakup isn't stupid.  Developing serious feelings for a significant other isn't stupid.  You may think so and that is somewhat of an opinion, but I say give it time.  You'll agree sooner or later.

Isn't having sex before you're married a sin? ( or something along those lines, I'm not religious )  You could argue that people who are religious get married to have sex. ( in a screwed up point of view )

no you couldnt

Pastor Gunderson (a guy from a local church) disagrees. He's quoted as saying "the reason we got married was because we couldn't wait to have sex!" Obviously, other reasons too, but eh?

And yeah, some of our local youth pastors are just plain scary how open they are about that kinda stuff. But yeah! True story!

[Krazed]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

You're an idiot Zero, seriously. Theres no reason to build a relationship around lies, and a lot more than 10% of the world knows that.

[ZeroX]

Call me shallow. Call me immature. Call me what you will. But iam postive that 90% of all relationships in the world are just built around lies and deceit. Now if your one of the lucky ones in the 10% range, then I suggest that you dont fuck it up becuase its rare to find someone that you truly love and that truly loves you back.
I am not talking about conventional love, like the love a mother shares for her child. But the love between two individuals of the OPPOSITE sex. Same sex "Love" is sick and immoral and that has no baring on the topic so I will not argue my point.

You're an idiot Zero, seriously. Theres no reason to build a relationship around lies, and a lot more than 10% of the world knows that.

Theres no reason, yes you are correct. People still do it anyways and The realtionships that last around 20 years are the ones that stay togther for their children sakes and not for their own. The ones that are close or near 40 years are the very few realtionships that work.

[Sidoh]

Theres no reason, yes you are correct. People still do it anyways and The realtionships that last around 20 years are the ones that stay togther for their children sakes and not for their own. The ones that are close or near 40 years are the very few realtionships that work.

Divorce rates are high, but they're not that high.  You are very cynical, by the way.

[trust]

I forget the figure, but the majority of people get divorced. We discussed it a week or two ago in Psychology.

[Sidoh]

I forget the figure, but the majority of people get divorced. We discussed it a week or two ago in Psychology.

A majority is 50%.  That's a pretty ambiguous claim...

Plus, divorce rates do not prove that a sincere relationship is impossible to achieve.  It is simply indicative of the changes in divorce laws (and other obvious things) over the recent decades... if a relationship that was assumed to work previously can no longer continue happily, there is now little sense in letting it continue.  People break up and move on with their lives (and perhaps become happily married in the future)...

[CrAz3D]

50%+ is a majority
but yeah, I think its like 52%? or so...

I think it just means that America is going to hell in a hand basket and many people would agree with me.
We don't have the same value sets we used to.  People dive into marriage and such things all willy-nilly like and just quit if the going gets tough

[Sidoh]

50%+ is a majority

Yeah, I had 50%-100%, but went back to change it to 50%+.  I must have deleted it or forgot to type it (ask Towelie, I'm having a problem doing much of anything today.  I'm running on about 12 hours of sleep over the past few days).

but yeah, I think its like 52%? or so...

I think it just means that America is going to hell in a hand basket and many people would agree with me.
We don't have the same value sets we used to.  People dive into marriage and such things all willy-nilly like and just quit if the going gets tough

That's a very conservative view.  Many people are conservative, so obviously they'll agree with you.

However, having different values doesn't mean that they are worse than the ones that were previously present...

[CrAz3D]

50%+ is a majority

Yeah, I had 50%-100%, but went back to change it to 50%+.  I must have deleted it or forgot to type it (ask Towelie, I'm having a problem doing much of anything today.  I'm running on about 12 hours of sleep over the past few days).

but yeah, I think its like 52%? or so...

I think it just means that America is going to hell in a hand basket and many people would agree with me.
We don't have the same value sets we used to.  People dive into marriage and such things all willy-nilly like and just quit if the going gets tough

That's a very conservative view.  Many people are conservative, so obviously they'll agree with you.

However, having different values doesn't mean that they are worse than the ones that were previously present...

hmmm

50s:
family, community, friends, education, national pride

now:
drugs, divorce, independence, over competitive big business, economy that draws both parents into the working place to allow kids to be raised by tv, America hating SOB's


yeah, not worse at all

[Sidoh]

now:
drugs, divorce, independence, over competitive big business, economy that draws both parents into the working place to allow kids to be raised by tv, America hating SOB's

Hahahaha.  You're so conservative it hurts.

[CrAz3D]

now:
drugs, divorce, independence, over competitive big business, economy that draws both parents into the working place to allow kids to be raised by tv, America hating SOB's

Hahahaha.  You're so conservative it hurts.

it hurts real good